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tiffanywint
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PostSubject: Bondathon methods and musings   Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:11 pm

Currently adapting a fresh method for my latest Bondathon. I watched the first 10 in order and then wearied of continuing in sequence. Problem is the first 9 films are my desert island films. I never tire of any of them and I do like watching them in order. All 9 are double-plus awesome.

But because I am not quite as obsessively enthralled with films 10-22, I thought, lets mix it up. So having watched Spy already, I've been randomly drawing down on the others, with great results. This technique I find allows one to appreciate these Bonds as stand-alones without looking at them as part of a broader era, which can happen when watching in sequence. Eg by the time DAD rolls around or even TWINE, one can be suffering Brozzer burnout and making pain-face in the mirror.

But with the random draw system the sense of anticipation is palpable. LTK drew first. Thoroughly enjoyed this Dalts masterpiece. Being a Sean purist, the trick I find to appreciating the non-Sean, non-Laz films is to avoid drawing comparisons. I often try and picture Sean playing the part, but until the perfectly rendered, life-like computer generated, Sean versions of all the non-Sean Bond films, box-set is released, I find the trick is to forget about Sean and simply relax and roll with these other actors being Bond. Just believe they are Bond. It's especially easy with Dalts. He really is quite convincing. LTK has moved right up in my ranking with this latest viewing. I might even bump it up to #10 ( best of the rest) The way Dalts goes about exacting revenge on Franz and company is something to behold. And the film has some nice Fleming nods.

Next up was FYEO. This also more grounded Bond rolled very nicely off the back of LTK. Rog as always has his moments, but he's more convincing in his more escapist outings I think. I'm dropping this one to #7 on my Rog rankings. I've never had it higher than 6th anyway. But as this is a less frills action-film, Rog's lack of athletic physicality becomes more evident. Rog kinda lumbers his way through the film. He seems almost exhausted from all the physical exertion required of his Bond in this film. FYEO seems like it might have been more suited to dare I say it, the reigning blond Mr. Fight-Fight Run-Run Bond. But still FYEO is a wonderful film to behold.

Next up is Brozzer time and TWINE. I'm actually looking forward to this - to Marceau and her shouting about her fami-lee. Glimmer-girl Richards. Cigar-chick, Warmflash, friendly fatso Zukovsky, parahawks, M in a cage. Good fun!!! And the best ever Brozzer pain-face - all bent out of shape, with a gun to the head of Renard the psycho, in the missle silo. The Broz face is in maximum full contort here. Renard I think finds the face more terrifying than the gun being waved at his head.
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James Bond
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:49 pm

Sounds like a good way of doing it but I think I'll have to go with the old fashioned way and watch them chronologically (DAMN YOU OCD :x)
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:37 am

I've never watched all 22 in order, to be honest! My method is just which one have I not seen in a while, and out of those, which one appeals to me right here and now? If it says anything, my last three have been Octopussy, From Russia with Love, and Moonraker, so there's no pattern there!
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:16 am

I don't do Bondathons, but I do watch all of the films (save DAD) on a rotating basis.

I watch one Bond film every three weeks, on either a Friday or Saturday night.

There is no decision as to which film I watch. My methodology is that the Bond films are ranked, and I've got a slip of paper with each film on it. The slips of paper are in order with the top ranked film followed by the bottom ranked film, and then the second ranked film followed by the penultimate film and so on down the line. I then watch them in that order. This method generates an appealing randomness and ensures that I don't watch my favs all at once and then confront all of my least favorites.

Oh, and I re-rank each film after each viewing. Then, when I've completed the cycle, I rearrange the slips of paper to reflect the new ranking and begin the cycle all over again. Obsessive and anal retentive, but it works for me!

:)
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:16 pm

Perilagu Khan wrote:
I don't do Bondathons, but I do watch all of the films (save DAD) on a rotating basis.

I watch one Bond film every three weeks, on either a Friday or Saturday night.

There is no decision as to which film I watch. My methodology is that the Bond films are ranked, and I've got a slip of paper with each film on it. The slips of paper are in order with the top ranked film followed by the bottom ranked film, and then the second ranked film followed by the penultimate film and so on down the line. I then watch them in that order. This method generates an appealing randomness and ensures that I don't watch my favs all at once and then confront all of my least favorites.

Oh, and I re-rank each film after each viewing. Then, when I've completed the cycle, I rearrange the slips of paper to reflect the new ranking and begin the cycle all over again. Obsessive and anal retentive, but it works for me!

:)

Great system Khanners! That method provides variety.

btw, here's the random order so far. I only draw one at a time. I've got a little bogged down since TWINE. Maybe its because I know DAD is next. tongue

10. LTK

11. FYEO

12. TWINE

13. DAD, pending. Just a fluke that it follows TWINE in order.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:54 am

You know, tiffy, I used to watch the films in chronological order and duly experienced DAD dread. Still, I forced myself to watch DAD two or three times. Then it occurred to me what a schmuck I was being. I mean, hell, why watch a movie you don't enjoy? It was at that point that I excised DAD from my Bondoverse, and I've felt better ever since.

:)
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Sun Jul 01, 2012 7:08 pm

Well I can handle DAD, but I don't really look forward to it. There's parts of it I really like, but there is so much of it I could do without.

Oddly enough QoS is an easier sit for me.There is really nothing I like about QoS but neither is there any stretch in the film that has me squirming from a simple watchability point of view. While the pithy dialogue in QoS is easily ignored, DAD does have some extended groaner segments which are hard to ignore.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:14 am

Yes, that's much to the point, tiffy. DAD is the ultimate cringe inducer. I'm embarrassed when I watch it.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:22 am

Yet you haven't watched it in half a decade!


Last edited by Largo's Shark on Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:35 am

I do very much like the whole Ice Palace segment of DAD. It's the kind of escapist Bond scenario that I like, but then there is also the bad CGI on the ice cliff.

Bond in Cuba IMO is a fun segment. It's got escapist touches as well. The Bond and Jinx, first meeting scene I could do without though.

Bond and Graves sword battle, I do enjoy, but I could do without Madonna's utterly pointless presence. An attractive competent actress in her place, would have been much better.

My biggest beef with DAD though is this notion that Bond would be locked away in a Korean prison-camp, like a regular chump for 14 months. Sorry, I don't want my Bond served up in such a faux-realistic manner. In my Bond world, Bond escapes within a matter of days, and the Scorpion-queen torturer ends up a victim of her pets.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:31 am

The problem with DAD is Halle Berry. It's not just coincidence that the film becomes one uninterrupted cringe from the moment she arrives.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:47 am

Perilagu Khan wrote:
The problem with DAD is Halle Berry. It's not just coincidence that the film becomes one uninterrupted cringe from the moment she arrives.

I did like her scene with the gene-therapy doctor though. She took him out with authority. I liked her cliff-dive too. I didn't even mind the Ursula Andress homage. "Yo mama" even kind of worked. She got stuck with some worst-of-Rog-worthy cheesball dialogue exchanges though with Piercey, especially their first meeting scene. Actually I am down with Halle for the most part. She was OK, but she won't make any of my top-20 Bond-girl lists. She and Broz made a decent crime-fighting team, but she could have used a better hair-style, and someof her lines could have been delivered a tad less ghetto.

I found the film to be rather overwhelmeing though, especially with the all the post ice-palace action overkill. The CGI was being piled on way too thick by this point. The final climactic transport-plane extended battle was excessive.

But I really did like the cinematography, especially the brilliant, cool blues-and-greens of the ice-scapes.

Pike was a classy, icey, femme-fatale wth a very appopos name. The movie IMO had its moments (I was actually able to believe Brozzer as Bond) but all told, the sum of it's parts didn't quite add up too well.

I do intend to leave in its rotation spot. I'll probably get to it in the next couple of days and then draw for the next entry.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:48 am

I don't think its fair to lumber too much blame on Halle, I actually pity the poor woman for the lines she was given to speak!

The real problem with DAD imho is simply the script, it begins with a number of good ideas but every one is squandered by the end, along that path there are also some interesting characters all of which are ineptly realised and of course everyone has to utter some of the worse dialogue this side of a George Lucas movie.

DAD is the worse casualty but imo initially interesting but poorly developed ideas and gobsmackingly atrotious dialogue (when not simply lifting Fleming's prose) remain a consistent theme from TWINE on out, its like there was some common factor.....
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:24 pm

Bondathon update: DAD is in the bank. I thoroughly enjoyed this latest viewing. Each time I view this utterly enjoyable orgy of escapist Bond nonsense, I find still more homage. There must be hundreds.

To wit: Jinx floating in water drowning, is homage to Wai Lin floating in water drowning during the climax of TND

Jinx punching at the ice, desperately trying to hang on to her last level of air before being submerged, is homage to Christmas Jones punching at the glass in the sub, desperate for Bond to open the hatch before she is submerged.

At Buckingham Palace there is a shot of a couple of dudes on horseback, complete with helmets,lurking behind the assembled media throng, which is an homage to the horse riding thugs in AVTAK

Graves exotic diamond mine terrarrium set-up, lush with green plants and water is an homage to Drax's rain forest set-up in MR. Both man-designed layouts look very similar.

As Jinx finds her way into Graves phony diamond mine, there is a very deliberate close-up shot of a quickdraw or draw, the device used by climbers to connect ropes to bolt anchors -- a piece of equipment prominently displayed in Bond's rock-face climbing in FYEO.

Bond's turning in the chair to surprise Graves, evokes Bond's turning in chair to greet the phony Widow Bouvar in TB.

If paying attention, virtually every scene is designed to evoke something from a previous Bond film.

We'll have to put a comphrehensive list together someday.

Bondathon update

10. LTK

11. FYEO

12. TWINE

13. DAD

Next up by random draw from films 11-22, yet another Brozzer entry....GE!
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:01 pm

To be honest there tiff I think that most of those are merely coincidences although there are definately a few clear homages in there.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:50 am

James Bond wrote:
To be honest there tiff I think that most of those are merely coincidences although there are definately a few clear homages in there.

I do stand by all the ones I've mentioned. See the DAD appreciation thread.

http://bondandbeyond.forumotion.com/t719p75-die-another-day-appreciation-thread
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:32 am

I withdraw the DAD close-up shot of the carabiner that Jinx secures prior to her infiltration of Grave's phony diamiond mine,

as an homage to FYEO. Actually it could still be, but it would also then have to serve as a nod to the GE pts, in which there is sharp close-up of the same implement before Bond launches his bungy jump.

Bondathon update of random drawing of films 11-22

11 LTK
12. FYEO
13. TWINE
14. DAD
15. GE
16. TND.
17. CR

AVTAK is on deck, with MR, OP, TLD and QoS still to come, in a to-be-determined random order.
CR was quite a schock to the system after 4 straight Brozzers. CR works ok as a stand-alone film, but I much prefer the Broz films, flawed as they maybe, as Bond entertainment.

DC btw not only sports the blue-snuggers in CR, but also later in the film, a pair of black bathing-snuggers, but the black snuggers are displayed in a much less ostentatious fashion.

CR has one of the most convoluted stories in all of Bond cinema. I finally have it figured out, but one really has to concentrate and think things through. There is only the bare mimimum of on-screen exposition, in terms of explaining what's going on behind the scenes with Vesper's predicament, shifting loyalties and White's machinations.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:42 am

No, I think OP and TWINE have far more convoluted stories than CR. But they're all the more interesting. :)
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:31 am

In the spring I watch Dr. No, TBall, LALD and OP (more or less in that order). They make me feel like getting out and getting some exercise.

In December I watch CR '54, OHMSS, DAF, TMWTGG, NSNA and DAD (the ones I most closely identify with the holiday season - lay on the champers and caviar!).

The rest don't have special times, although TSWLM, MR, FYEO, TLD and LTK make good summer views when it's too hot to go outside (plus they were all summer releases).

I only did a chronological marathon once - one every Friday - but as I like to keep my December Bonds for December, I haven't done it since.

I am so looking forward to December, so I can watch my holiday favorites again.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Tue Jul 17, 2012 2:24 pm

Good system Hornet!

FieldsMan wrote:
No, I think OP and TWINE have far more convoluted stories than CR. But they're all the more interesting. :)

Yes, OP gets a little tricky with sussing out what's going on with the looting of the jewels, and keeping track of the on-screen movements of the bomb. TWINE is a tad confusing in terms of figuring out what's going on with how Robert King was killed and how that ties in with Bond's earlier meeting with the banker, but CR for me takes the cake. And here's why. Only us hard-core Bond fans that were compelled to put the work in, have managed to figure out what the heck was going on and even then, as I will demonstrate, we have to make a lot of best guesses, just like M and Bond do.

Meanwhile ask any casual movie-goer that has seen CR once, even twice, and ask them to figure out what was going down. They will try. They might even think they have it figured out, but if you put the tough questions to them, they will wilt.

START of CR AS MASSIVE HEADSCRATCHER ESSAY

for more please follow this link:

http://bondandbeyond.forumotion.com/t1694-casino-royale-really-makes-us-do-a-lot-of-guess-work#59334
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:33 am

Bondathon update

11 LTK
12. FYEO
13. TWINE
14. DAD
15. GE
16. TND.
17. CR
18. AVTAK

QoS is on-deck with MR, OP and TLD in a to be determined random order still to come.

Thoughts on AVTAK. Call it the famous-structural-landmark Bond. Bond does battle at both the Eiffel Tower and the Golden Gate Bridge, in the same film.

Zorin foreshadows Domenic Greene with his GG bridge axe-routine.

Stacey foreshadows Sarah Palin with her "you betcha" :) response to Bond, as the big bridge finale finishes up.

Stacey still cracks me up with her prancing about in next-to-nothing lingerie, the morning after poor gentleman Rog, stayed over as simply a house-guest, not a bed-mate.

And I realize Q likes to play with his toys, but did he really have to go to all that trouble of launching his remote-controlled 4 wheeled mini-R2D2 robot to seek out Bond in Stacey's house.

Couldn't he have just knocked on the door or walked right in. The mission was over.

"Hey Stacey, good see you are alive, and that you didn't fall off the bridge and into the drink. Is wonderboy here by the way?" :)
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:11 pm

Bondathon update

11 LTK
12. FYEO
13. TWINE
14. DAD
15. GE
16. TND.
17. CR
18. AVTAK
19. QoS

QoS random thoughts. The biggest problem with this film, among many, is that Forster and Haggis managed to hi-jack the franchise, and stamp their puerile leftist, anti-American, anti-capitalism politics all over the narrative. It's like a bad smell that permeates proceedings. But even when you set that aside, the film is still an awful Bond film. Even though it tries to insert some lighter moments, the tone of the film is still utterly depressing.

But then how to do you salvage any humour or joie de vivre, when one of the prevailing themes of the film, is that big bad U.S. and British oil interests, are bent on working with the worst of criminal elements to guard our supposedly dwindling oil supplies, causing the helpless indigine peoples of the global south to be exploited and raped of their water supplies. Not once, but twice we are told, (first by a rep of the CIA -- the section chief for South America, no less -- and again, in case we missed it the first time, by no less a personage than the British Foreign Secretary) that because we are so desperate for oil, that we must lie down with such dogs - that we must do business with bad people, because our corrupt economies are so dependant on evil oil. The not very subtle inference being, we should be damaging our already fragile economies further, by diverting precious financial resources into unreliable renewable energy schemes, even if there is no business model to support them. But we got to do it, otherwise phony greenies, like Greene, will rob our brothers and sisters in the global south of their water, and they will all die of thirst, while we gorge oil and Greene laughs all the way to the bank. Well when you put it like that, sign me up for the nearest Occupy protest. We must tear down this corrupt society and petition the gubment to impose "fairness".

Meanwhile in the real world, the oil supply is plentiful. We are bathing in Alberta oil, here in Canada. The Middle East is a problem area politically, but there don't seem to be any supply issues. We just have to put up with their bs, along with competing hostile interests in places like China and Russia, to get what we need. The Arabs have to sell it to someone, so we are not likely to get cut off. Meanwhile there are plenty of off-shore oil reserves that can be tapped. The world has more than enough oil for probably 100 years and maybe then some.

QoS is anti-western propagandized nonsense which of course is Haggis' stock in trade, because Haggis being the superior thinker that he is, demands that the world be fair! Forster subscribes to a lot of the same naive nonsense.

There really is no such thing as a fun leftist message film,(Woody Allen's Bananas aside, and its not really in-your-face) so the team of Haggis and Forster had this venture doomed from the outset.

What an awful Bond movie. I think I will purge it from future Bondathons. It drags down what should be a fun exercise. I will no longer watch this film within the context of legitimate Bond film viewing. Rather I will watch it as stand-alone only, outside of organized Bond film watching.

Why watch it at all, you might ask? Good question. Truth is much of the filmcraft does have an appeal. I do very much like the look of the film. I even like the music, and Craig-Bond, although he is still battling his demons, does do Bond-as-blunt instrument quite well. His Bond persona is somewhat compelling. His Bond is at least focused on mission. He is motivated by duty. He does bring Connery like swagger, which is saying a lot.

I can watch this movie as a --I won't say interesting film, because there is nothing very interesting or smart about any of its themes -- but as an intriguing piece of cinema. It moves along and passes the time. I'm never bored. Yes, there is barfing at the pithy dialogue sometimes, but not squirming due to tedium.

But the film does work, as a canvas for blunt-instrument Bond, hunting down and bringing some very vile badguys to justice. Olga as Camille really spices things up too. I like her smokey manner. Mathis is interesting. The Bond Mathis re-union meeting, I thought was well done, and provided some smart humour. When Haggis isn't lecturing, he's not hopeless as a writer. Could have done without the dumpster bit though. Surely there was another way to write this scene. Forster is a compentent filmmaker, so even though the brazen leftist political messaging sours the mix, not to mention the tedious carry-over of trust issues from the previous film, Forster can still craft a watchable movie. Many hopelessly liberal filmmakers can.

So I am pleased to say that QoS doesn't completely suck. It is an absolute abomination of a Bond film, and I have purged it from canon, but it is watchable on other levels. :D

Next up a real Bond movie, one of MR, OP or TLD. Have to see how the coin flip turns out.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:08 pm

Bondathon update

11 LTK
12. FYEO
13. TWINE
14. DAD
15. GE
16. TND.
17. CR
18. AVTAK
19. QoS
20. OP

OP is done! Great Bond adventure. Who knew Dexter Smythe had a daughter named OP?

Bond breakthrough: for the first time ever, I was able to perfectly make sense of and follow, all of the train movements and locations of the stolen jewels and bomb, plus which egg was which. Finally I "own" this film.

Next up MR, which means TLD finishes things for this random drawing of films 11-22 Bondathon.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Sun Jul 22, 2012 6:39 pm

Bondathon update

11 LTK
12. FYEO
13. TWINE
14. DAD
15. GE
16. TND.
17. CR
18. AVTAK
19. QoS
20. OP
21. MR

MR random thoughts. One of the all-time great Bonds. If nu-Bond is not going to do a film on the MR scale, or get back to the classic supervillain/exotic lairs/henchmen/girls-everywhere template from time to time, then another series should take over, with a Bond-like hero.

I would suggest Remo Willams, the Destroyer, and of course his mentor Chiun. Chiun carps at Remo, just like Mommy-M carps at Bond, so that parallel is in place, plus the Destroyer novels are violent escapist flights of fancy, with supervillains, lairs and girls galore. The authors do acknowledge borrowing from Bond.

Cast some young guy as Remo, get it back on the big screen, and we are good to go again! Start with the Dr. Quake novel. Give it a Bond-like title right off the bat.

Or get the Man From Uncle on the big screen again.

Damn, MR is one fine Bond movie. We get not only one mega-lair set, with girls and henchmen, but two of them. Such Bond bounty, and all in one film. I could watch the last 40 minutes or so on endless loop, from Bond's arrival at the rubber-snake pit to the final, "take me around the world one more time."

Has anyone noticed that Drax's killer dogs seem to morph from the cucumber-sandwich tete-a-tete Dobermans, to something else by the time they attack poor Corrine (who should have jumped in the golf cart to make her escape). They seem to have fuller faces, more like rotweilers. Oh well, maybe Drax kenneled both breeds.

And speaking of Drax. What an awesome super-villain. He even wore Blofeld like jackets.

And Lois Chiles has the most lustrous hair of any Bond-girl. It practically shimmers.

I noticed in the credit crawl, that both the ambulance guy, (in-back with Bond and Holly), and the gondolier actor, were also listed as stuntmen, so those guys, I imagine, did their own stunt work.
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PostSubject: Re: Bondathon methods and musings   Mon Jul 23, 2012 7:23 am

tiffanywint wrote:

And speaking of Drax. What an awesome super-villain. He even wore Blofeld like jackets.
I won't criticize your appreciation of MR, Tiff, but I must dispute your assessment of Drax.

When Curt Jergens first appeared onscreen in TSWLM, I thought EON had brought Blofeld back. He had the look, and all the trappings - right down to threatening to kill one person, then killing another instead. If the villain had been Blofeld, he would have required no backstory. As it was, Stromberg simply did not have a backstory - he was just a rich loon with lots of criminals working for him.

Enter Drax: smooth, reserved, of undertemined origins, wearing - as you say - a costume reminiscent of an earlier villain, with the same neon sign around his neck that Jurgens wore, flashing 'villain' in big red letters.

So Drax mocked the British while trying to emulate their class and style. So he wanted to exterminate mankind and repopulate the earth with his chosen people.

Why?

Stromberg at least had webbed hands, leading one to assume that he identified with sea creatures more than he did with mankind. The Sir Hugo Drax of Fleming's novel had facial and emotional scars from WWII, when he was hoist with his own petard while disguised as a British soldier. Drax of the film has nowt of that - just a super-sized dose of megalomania.

IMCO Drax was a stage villain - a moustache-twirling Snidely Whiplash whom we're invited to boo. If he hadn't insisted on seeing that some harm come to Bond, 007 would have had no reason to investigate him.

But then, given the simplistic structure of MR, perhaps having a properly-motivated villain might have been a waste of screen-time - better to avoid the Christmas rush and start hating him right from the outset. We've become conditioned to accept that every successful capitalist is a villain in Bond's world, so why should Drax need any explaining?

I suppose what I'm saying is that I found Drax to be just as one-dimensional and OTT as everything else in MR, so I find it hard to rate him as highly as other powerful maniacs such as Dr. No and Goldfinger, who at least took a moment to explain what motivates them. Drax was motivated by the script, and its need to culminate in a confrontation in space. To that end he fit the bill.

Not mad anout his tailor, though.
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