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M
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PostSubject: RACISM   Mon Sep 03, 2012 11:41 am

We're scaring members away from this place rather steadily at the moment, and my inbox seems to be permanently cursed with complaints and accusations that I'm condoning racism and other offensive material right now, which of course is BS. But some others don't feel that way about it. This post is just a heads-up to hopefully encourage people to please show a bit of restraint in politically-charged topics. I hate having to rain on anybody's right to free speech here, but I think that we need to start weighing up the importance of such topics when placed against the possible departure of members, some of them good ones.

Right now, truth be told, I just feel like tearing the "General Discussion" and "News" topics right off the boards, even though there are quite a large number of fantastic posts in each. j7wild may be gone, but the complaints keep coming. Can we please be ultra-careful (especially moderators) because, among other complaints, I'm being accused of choosing "racists" as moderators and "allowing" those accused to dominate the mindset of the forums. I'm not seeing this the same way as some of the complainants, as I still stand by every single moderator here 100%, but the fact is that different people are complaining, and I seem to be receiving a resignation request/threat/ultimatum around once a week at the moment. Can we just try and concentrate on other stuff, if only for a short while, just until this pressure cooker turns itself down a touch? Ultimately, the reputation of the forums could be seriously damaged if these kind of complaints keep on coming and people keep wanting to leave.


Thanks,


M
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bitchcraft
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:26 pm

M wrote:
I'm being accused of choosing "racists" as moderators and "allowing" those accused to dominate the mindset of the forums

I'm trying to figure out how any Mod here 'dominates' the mindset...anyone is free to post a contrary opinion to a mod but I suspect we have some spineless complainers lurking around....

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Largo's Shark
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:40 pm

I'm guessing it's Khan and Gravity that are being accused of wacism, here. I have strong doubts that it's any long-time contributors to BAB that are threatening to jump. If you've been with us a for a while, you grow a thick skin, and get used to our quirks and strong opinions. It's more likely to be a bunch Kennon Mk. IIs. Posters that greatly overvalue their own importance and demand a big exit

If you want to leave, leave. Destroying your own account only implies you're fighting some urge to return..
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Perilagu Khan
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Mon Sep 03, 2012 11:24 pm

I challenge these spineless cowards to come out in the open and debate like men.

Sound to me like they're trying to gain dominance of this site through their sniveling backbiting because they are incapable of measuring up in the flesh, as it were.

As for my own posting, I haven't made a "controversial" post in weeks.
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Gravity's Silhouette
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:48 am

M wrote:
This post is just a heads-up to hopefully encourage people to please show a bit of restraint in politically-charged topics.

But what if we already are? What if some of us with the "controversial" opinions are being restrained as much as one can be and these people are still not satisfied? What then? Do we just shut up entirely?


Quote :
I hate having to rain on anybody's right to free speech here, but I think that we need to start weighing up the importance of such topics when placed against the possible departure of members, some of them good ones.

The importance of being able to speak HONESTLY about hot-button issues vastly outweighs the possible departure of some members; they don't even rate or show up on the scale. There is simply no comparison.

Quote :
Right now, truth be told, I just feel like tearing the "General Discussion" and "News" topics right off the boards, even though there are quite a large number of fantastic posts in each. j7wild may be gone, but the complaints keep coming. Can we please be ultra-careful (especially moderators)

We already ARE being "ultra-careful". There is no room left for us to maneuver. It is OUR backs that are up against the wall, not the people complaining. They are used to living in a blissful, care-free world void of reality, opinions, or facts that contradict what they wish to believe. I won't give them that satisfaction as long as there is a breath left in my keyboard.



Quote :
as I still stand by every single moderator here 100%,

Really? Because from this point of view the support looks a tad bit timid and unsure of itself.

Quote :

Can we just try and concentrate on other stuff, if only for a short while, just until this pressure cooker turns itself down a touch?

What "pressure cooker"? Are these posters highly-placed government agents or bureaucrats capable of making your life difficult? I doubt it. They come across as a bunch of gutless, early-twenty-something liberal-arts majors who think because they're in college or graduated from college that they've got the whole world figured out, and that anybody who doesn't tow the ideological line they put out is a racist, homophobic, xenophobic, misogynistic bigot. I won't acquiesce to intimidation.

And once we all just 'concentrate on other stuff', what happens when the next big hot-button issue comes up and these people don't like what is being said? What new conditions will they attempt to put upon the forum? Once you give in to their demands, the demands will only increase in frequency and severity.

So, you know where I stand on this. You do what you feel is best, M. Do what you need to do. I won't take it personally. But just understand I am not going to water down, cool-off, or concentrate on anything else to make some people feel better about not facing some of life's harsh realities. I've actually been far more diplomatic than I would like to be, but there's nowhere else for me to go with my comments other than to disavow what I believe and/or to simply shut up, and I can't do that. I won't. And don't fool yourself into believing you can make an uneasy-peace with these complainers. There's no room on a message board for people who believe in honesty and those who want to live in denial. At some point you'll have to make a choice, M.
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Largo's Shark
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:34 am

Agreed entirely with Gravy, here. Walking on eggshells with these posters is futile if we don't know who they are, what they are offended by. and mostly importantly - why. Either give them what they want and terminate their accounts, or have them speak up in front of the mods in question, either through PM, via proxy with M, or here in the Archive.

This confidentially and vagueness of accusations is doing no one any favours.
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:04 am

Gravity, Khan & Sharky, I'm with you guys on this, trust me. It would save me a whole lot of aggravation if people could just discuss their problems and/or differences out on the forums. If needs be, I'd sacrifice those who are maybe just playing up to make a "grand exit" over mods whose only "offence" is maybe holding a different opinion. But I'd rather not have to, which is why I'm hoping some middle ground or compromise can be found. If the forum ends up being driven solely by a dozen or so core members, I fear those members will eventually tire of one another, which is why I really want everybody to stay on board and help to expand the forums rather than decimate them. In my eyes, there haven't been many posts here which are really worthy of anybody storming out over. Communication needs to start happening between members instead of people just coming to me with thinly veiled ultimatums.

The "vagueness" Sharky refers to is unfortunately kind of unavoidable, as I'd always try to extend the courtesy of confidentiality to any member who PM's me, or else that communication would not have been sent privately in the first place. But Khan has a point that maybe it's time some problems here were sorted out "like men" on the forums themselves, because these walkout threats and veiled ultimatums are becoming predictable and tiresome. If someone doesn't agree with a certain opinion, there's nothing stopping them voicing out about it, trying to resolve differences with the member in question or simply avoiding the topic. But this unfortunately isn't happening right now. I can only hope this situation changes sometime soon.

Sincerely,


M

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Perilagu Khan
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:04 am

M, you cannot please everybody. You can either truckle to those who are threatening you and alienate many of the core members in the process, or you can tell those undercover blackguards to get stuffed. In the latter case, they obviously will not be happy. My advice--not that you asked for it!--would be to politely put off those who are threatening you, at least until SF has hit the screen. Hopefully SF will bring an influx of good new posters and the "value" of the race-baiters will be rendered null and void. You simply won't need them at all. If SF doesn't bring in new members and the complainers persist, at that point it may be time for a rethink.
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Erica Ambler
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PostSubject: Re: RACISM   Wed Sep 12, 2012 2:48 am

Having spent a few months looking in and only able to see the Bond and Beyond sub-forums I regret to say that the atmosphere in here did appear to be toxic, at least to an outsider. Maybe BABs isn't the place to be having heated political disagreements. Certainly once this place ceases to be fun it will hemorrhage members and that seems to have happened. At one point recently the place seemed to be receiving less than 10 posts a day.
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