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 Three young Muslim students murdered in their home

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Salomé
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PostSubject: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 2:11 am

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A family of three young Muslims has been shot dead in their home in a quiet neighbourhood of North Carolina in the US.

Police have named the victims as 23-year-old Deah Shaddy Barakat, his wife, Yusor Mohammad Abu-Salha, 21, and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19.

Officers were called to reports of gunshots at 5.11pm at an apartment block largely housing academics and young professionals on Summerwalk Circle in Chapel Hill.

The victims were found shot dead at the scene, while some residents described not even being aware there was an incident until police arrived. Sources told local WRAL News that all three had been shot in the head.

An anti-Muslim/anti-religious motive is suspected.

Several sources claim they were killed execution style with two bullets to the head.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-three-young-muslims-gunned-down-in-north-carolina-at-their-family-home-10037734.html

Islamophobia does not exist in some abstract vacuum.
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Staugust
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:03 am

Sad indeed but unsurprising. It's mostly a case of what goes around comes around - the slaughter of the innocents. The universe must right itself accordingly to be in equilibrium.
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Makeshift Python
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 12:36 pm

Saddening. I wonder how downplayed this will be in the US media.
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Prisoner Monkeys
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 2:02 pm

Salomé wrote:
Islamophobia does not exist in some abstract vacuum.
I'd be careful making statements like that. It almost sounds like victim-blaming.

Islamophobia may not exist in an abstract vacuum, but bigotry and ignorance can - and do. Three innocent people died because of the apparent prejudices of one man, so they should not be held responsible for his actions because of their faith.
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Xenia93
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:56 pm

Makeshift Python wrote:
Saddening. I wonder how downplayed this will be in the US media.

Which is almost as saddening.
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Prisoner Monkeys
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:36 pm

The police have switched focus, querying whether the shooter killed his victims over a parking dispute as he had reportedly clashed with neighbours over parking in the past.
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Strangways&Quarrel
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:43 pm

Sadly this is either going to be swept under the rug or politicized to hell and back regardless of why it happened.
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Salomé
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:28 pm

The parking dispute thing is only based on the claims of the man's wife.
Likely it is a conscious tactic of his defense, since he is sure to face a far harsher punishment if he is found guilty of a hate crime.
If they can convince the court this was him going off in a rage over the parking spot, he is sure to get a much lighter sentence.
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Gravity's Silhouette
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:10 pm

Salomé wrote:
The parking dispute thing is only based on the claims of the man's wife.
Likely it is a conscious tactic of his defense, since he is sure to face a far harsher punishment if he is found guilty of a hate crime.
If they can convince the court this was him going off in a rage over the parking spot, he is sure to get a much lighter sentence.

Every murder is a hate crime. Why should some reasons for murder be extra harsh in the sentencing than others? "Hate crimes" are just thought-crimes, and you'd be finding him guilty of thinking politically incorrect thoughts and then acting upon them. Once you've brought yourself to the point of being capable of killing three people, is the threat of being labeled a hate-monger or a racist really that much of a deterrent? I believe in capital punishment, so I believe the man should be executed by the state. I don't see how tacking on a "hate crime" charge makes him any more deader. We have existing laws in place that are more than capable of adequately punishing him.
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Erica Ambler
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Fri Feb 13, 2015 9:19 pm

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
Every murder is a hate crime.

That's not accepted by everyone these days. There's a strong body of opinion in criminology and psychology that holds that most murders have a moral element. May sound odd, but the fact is that individual murders are generally committed by people who knew - and in many cases loved - their victims. (France has long recognised this with its crime passionnel.) In other words, murder is usually unpremeditated and takes place in an effort to prevent behaviour that the murderer finds unacceptable.

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
Why should some reasons for murder be extra harsh in the sentencing than others?

Because some murders are premeditated and others are not. See above.

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
I believe the man should be executed by the state.

And what when the state is the murderer, as was the case with Turkey, Nazi Germany and the USSR? The state is not some unimpeachable entity.
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Salomé
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Fri Feb 13, 2015 10:17 pm

Erica Ambler wrote:


Because some murders are premeditated and others are not. See above.


The entire parking dispute story is the basis for his defense, precisely because he could then argue that it was not premeditated.
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Gravity's Silhouette
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Sat Feb 14, 2015 4:29 pm

Erica Ambler wrote:


...takes place in an effort to prevent behaviour that the murderer finds unacceptable.

I.e. *hates*.

Erica Ambler wrote:
Because some murders are premeditated and others are not. See above.

Yes some killings are premeditated, but once you start getting into "hate crime" legislation, you are getting into thought crimes...punishing people for having the wrong thoughts instead of punishing the wrong actions. I am against ALL HATE CRIME LEGISLATION, even if the victims are white. Here's an example of a case that never got much national attention and probably could have, and should have, merited "hate crime" charges:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/07/christopher-newsom-channon-christian_n_2426358.html.

Yet despite both of them being raped, tortured, and murdered, I would be against "hate crime" charges being filed; their murderers and their accomplices should have been put to death themselves based solely on their actions, not their thoughts. We have laws on the books for these types of actions, and creating sub-classes and sub-sets of victims based on sexuality, religion, race, etc...doesn't stop crimes from being committed against them and actually stigmatizes whole groups of people by singling them out as in need of special protection instead of prosecuting the crimes against them just as you would prosecute a similar crime against anyone else that didn't fall within the minority subset.
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Erica Ambler
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:56 am

Unacceptable does not mean the same as hate. Why pretend it does?
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Gravity's Silhouette
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:02 am

Erica Ambler wrote:
Unacceptable does not mean the same as hate. Why pretend it does?

Unacceptable = intolerance. Intolerance = hate. Hate leads to violence. At least that's what the left has been telling me for years.
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Erica Ambler
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:15 am

As you're American I'll defer to Webster's:

Unacceptable = falling short of a standard.

Hate = a very strong dislike.
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Hilly KCMG
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:20 am

drugs
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Staugust
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:39 am

How about some skunk?
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Hilly KCMG
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PostSubject: Re: Three young Muslim students murdered in their home   Mon Feb 16, 2015 6:29 am

Anything to take the edge off.
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