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 Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE

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Which Final Act is Better?
Die Another Day
75%
 75% [ 6 ]
SPECTRE
25%
 25% [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 8
 

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FieldsMan
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PostSubject: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Tue May 30, 2017 10:57 pm

Curious to know what people think is a better final act in these two Bond films. They are the fourth films of Brosnan and Craig respectively, feature a grander story and are considered to be weaker portions of the Bond films.

It's entirely up to you what constitutes the final act of DAD and SP, but I'd say from when Bond and Jinx board the Antonov until the end in DAD, and the London segment of SP.

Personally, I think the end of DAD is better. It's more efficient and snappier, Brosnan is still focused and not approaching the role in a half-assed fashion, and it's still fun in an outrageous way. SP's final act drags and takes itself too seriously to be fun. Not to mention the film could have been wrapped up on Morocco. The same argument could be made for DAD finishing at the Ice Palace (as Purvis and Wade originally intended), but I can see some sense in Graves wanting to get closer to the action.

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lachesis
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Tue May 30, 2017 11:52 pm

Against my own expectation I also plumbed for DAD, Robocop suit aside the action really brings things together and the disintegrating plane is a terrific concept, it may be that it is so much a relief after the dreadful stuff in the Ice hotel but it ensures that the film ends above its lowest point etc....also Rosamund Pike in 'proper' villain gear at last yummy err I digress.... By contrast SP denouement is really the literal lowest ebb of that film where contrivance and self importance really overwhelm the plot, its also a dull sequence after a far more tense one, the best part probably being M Vs C.... Daniel Craig may be notable for being the only actor that I think could make me lose all interest in the actual James Bond role :/ M, Q, Tanner and Moneypenny actually make for far more engaging presences here.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 12:47 am

The only truly dreadful scene in the Ice Palace is the laser scene with Mr Kil. Everything else I can roll with, and I find much more palatable than the Antonov stuff.

Regarding SP, it does become less about Bond and more about the MI6 team. Perhaps it is down to Craig, or perhaps it's the writing, but either way I'm personally disengaged throughout. I don't appreciate M involved in combat despite a solid scene leading to it, and I don't enjoy Q, Moneypenny and Tanner's involvement since it's not warranted.
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lachesis
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 1:18 am

FieldsMan wrote:
The only truly dreadful scene in the Ice Palace is the laser scene with Mr Kil. Everything else I can roll with, and I find much more palatable than the Antonov stuff.

Regarding SP, it does become less about Bond and more about the MI6 team. Perhaps it is down to Craig, or perhaps it's the writing, but either way I'm personally disengaged throughout. I don't appreciate M involved in combat despite a solid scene leading to it, and I don't enjoy Q, Moneypenny and Tanner's involvement since it's not warranted.

It may not be appropriate but it is warranted when your Bond is as dull as dishwater even by his usual bored and bland standards.

I have a lot of problems with the ice Palace sequence.. after a spirited start to the movie it pretty much derails the moment we see snow - beit the aforementioned laser battle, the bewilderingly dull straight line laser evasion, the inept para surfing cgi fest and that staggeringly unexciting and anticlimactic car ballet (as it really doesn't warrant the use of the term 'car chase'). Even worse to round it all off Jinx lives..... she's better in the finale too mind......
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bitchcraft
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 6:22 am

I'd go with DAD.

SPECTRE was over for me after the torture scene.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 7:16 am

DAD.

Imagine there being this much of a consensus over DAD on the old forum colgate
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 12:02 pm

Hilly KCMG wrote:
DAD.

Imagine there being this much of a consensus over DAD on the old forum colgate

Indeed. laugh

lachesis wrote:
It may not be appropriate but it is warranted when your Bond is as dull as dishwater even by his usual bored and bland standards.

Touche.

lachesis wrote:
I have a lot of problems with the ice Palace sequence.. after a spirited start to the movie it pretty much derails the moment we see snow - beit the aforementioned laser battle, the bewilderingly dull straight line laser evasion, the inept para surfing cgi fest and that staggeringly unexciting and anticlimactic car ballet (as it really doesn't warrant the use of the term 'car chase'). Even worse to round it all off Jinx lives..... she's better in the finale too mind......

Personally, I like Lamont's production design which elevates this portion of the film. The car chase is satisfactory in my opinion. There's a hint of danger in Zao's car as well as the ice grounding which makes it a little more exciting. I'd label the SP car chase with the 'car ballet' tag over this one. Not to mention there's great moments between Frost and Bond sprinkled throughout (her reveal as the mole, "sex for dinner" scene, their love scene) which I like. I also like Bond snooping around the diamond mine after the demonstration.

I'll give you the 'Jinx lives' notion, and the idea that she's better in the finale, but I actually quite like her when she comes to after almost drowning - the 'what took you so long' and their exchange was tender.


Last edited by FieldsMan on Wed May 31, 2017 11:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 5:03 pm

Every act of DAD was better than SPECTRE. SP commits the sin of being both boring and self-important. Whatever one thinks of MR or DAD, I'm not sure they've ever been accused of being boring.

You can say that MR and DAD aim too high, but I'd rather have a film aim too high and miss instead of aim too low and find its target.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Wed May 31, 2017 10:14 pm

DAD, even with the Nintendo-looking plane, the white Asian's electro-tailoring, and the Jinx-Frost catfight. That's how bad SP's final act was.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:34 am

DAD's final act at least had the [hammy] if delicious lines: "Looks like your friends have bailed!"

/"Time to face gravity!"

Also, nice use of the Bond theme towards the end of the Antonov scene. Almost a shame Brosnan's tenure ended in that manner. Imagine if Moore's final act had been Moonraker. Last seen hurtling into orbit one more time.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 11:44 am

Hilly KCMG wrote:
DAD's final act at least had the [hammy] if delicious lines: "Looks like your friends have bailed!"

/"Time to face gravity!"

Also, nice use of the Bond theme towards the end of the Antonov scene. Almost a shame Brosnan's tenure ended in that manner. Imagine if Moore's final act had been Moonraker. Last seen hurtling into orbit one more time.

I'm a fan of the 'I can read your every move' / 'read this, bitch' lines, myself. laugh

At least Bond ends with a girl in bed. Bond wouldn't know what to do with one of those nowadays.

EDIT: Looks like SP finally got a vote... Wonder who from, and why?
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 3:53 pm

FieldsMan wrote:


At least Bond ends with a girl in bed. Bond wouldn't know what to do with one of those nowadays.

I was thinking about that today. About how depressing the Bond Girls have been in the Craig era. Let's contrast and compare lead Bond Girls:

Moore: Fortune teller, Embassy Assistant (?) Russian Spy, American Spy, underwater archaeologist, international jewel smuggler, geologist

Dalton: cello player, ex-cia pilot

Brosnan: computer programmer, Chinese spy, nuclear scientist, NSA operative

All seven of Moore's lead Bond Girls end up in bed with him at the end. Same with Dalton and I guess Brosnan if you count Elektra as the villain and not the lead bond girl.

Conversely, Craig's Bond Girls mostly end up dead...or rejecting him: Vesper (suicide); Solange (murdered), Camille (rejects Bond), Strawberry (murdered), Severine (murdered), Lucia (lives, but is a depressed, alcoholic widow), Madeline (lives, but is a resentful, alcoholic daughter of a villain).

By the way, I had to look up on IMDB the page for SPECTRE, because I couldn't remember the names of the characters from SPECTRE, but had no problem recalling any of the other character names going all the way back to LALD. That's how unremarkable SPECTRE is.

Only one Bond Girl dies because of her association with Brosnan's Bond (Paris), although 3 die because of Moore's Bond (Andrea, Corrine and Lisl). No Bond Girl died during Dalton's tenure, which is odd considering the subject matter of LTK.

Point is there's not much variety in the Craig cannon. It's dour and depressing. No Plenty's....no Pussy's...no Chew Me's or Onatopps. Not even a Christmas amongst the offerings.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:33 pm

It seems Lucia and Madeleine exist solely as a knee-jerk reaction to the idea that Craig era Bond girls haven't survived or don't end up with him. I don't for a second believe that Lucia survived after Bond left her. SPECTRE (in this incarnation particularly) is intent on tying up loose ends, as demonstrated with picking an assassin to kill the Pale King, so leaving Lucia to her own devices seems a little artificial.

And they fucked Madeleine up harder than Craig Bond's blue balls. Severine remains the sole highlight of his era in the women department.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:41 pm

Hilly KCMG wrote:
DAD's final act at least had the [hammy] if delicious lines: "Looks like your friends have bailed!"

That just sparked a memory - wasn't there a troll on Old MI6 called Hammy? Struggling to remember.

EDIT: Or am I thinking of Scashy?

FieldsMan wrote:
Severine remains the sole highlight of his era in the women department.

Solange's tits though.
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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:58 pm

You win.



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PostSubject: Re: Final Act: Die Another Day vs SPECTRE   Thu Jun 01, 2017 8:09 pm

That kid chasing after the mounted tits is gonna grow up just fine.
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