These forums may contain mild adult content and are not associated with EON, Sony or any other companies and do not reflect their views.
 
HomeHome  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
AuthorMessage
trevanian
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1385
Member Since : 2011-03-15
Location : Pac NW

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:14 am

Well, the nutso price tag on QoS is largely a matter of having a printed in stone release date that left no time for finesse during postproduction (a Bond tradition going way the hell back, but this most recent film had over 900 VFX shots in it, not 35 or 40), which means tons of companies on the back end and probably insane overtime (like TERMINATOR 2, where the OT alone bought lots of tech guys their houses and drove that budget to 90 mil, which was REALLY something 20 years back.)

If Bond 23 doesn't shoot till Jan or so, you're looking at another really short turnaround time in post to make Nov 2012 ... one advantage is that shooting digital means you don't have to scan the film elements before playing with them, but there are down sides to this as well. The guy who shot AVATAR said he thinks it is more flexible to make adjustments to a film image during post in the digital intermediate process than to do the same with a digital image ...

I still don't know what to think about her choice (I assume it was her call, could be wrong) of John Logan to 'fix' the script. I hate most of his work, plus I wonder if his selection has to do with his Hollywood status as THE popular gay screenwriter of recent years, or more to do with his supposed list of credits, most of which are projects he did work on, but didn't usually contribute enormously to since there were other writers involved (except for most of his solo efforts that just plain out SUCKED, from BATS to STAR TREK NEMESIS ... I have no explanation for his solo credit on RANGO, unless he turned a significant corner in his writing.)
Back to top Go down
trevanian
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1385
Member Since : 2011-03-15
Location : Pac NW

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:23 am

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
trevanian wrote:
As best I can tell, SHE is the reason Craig was selected as Bond, over all sorts of reasonable objections and better candidates, and whatever other calls she makes, THAT is enough for me to really seriously dislike her. No matter how well a Bond film might be made, it still has that uglyass albatross around its neck in the form of Craig, who should be playing LeChiffre's henchman or may-be Felix Leiter.

I wouldn't go that far. It's true she was the only one that wanted Craig, but I don't think he's an albatross. He does bring some things to the table that his predecessors couldn't or wouldn't. Whether those are things you like or dislike is a matter of personal choice.

Yeah, it is a personal choice thing, but for somebody with a 'first-ever-movie-memory' being GOLDFINGER before I turned 4, who saw all of these things multiple times in the theater (except TND and DAD, which I had bad feeling about and skipped till homevid), to completely discount the notion of seeing CR just on the Craig casting, that's a pretty huge reversal.

I mean, I even saw all the Moore pictures (most of which I detested) in the cinema, but the Craig casting was just a bridge too far. It's an incredible tribute to SOME QoS elements that it overcame both my ongoing objections to Craig and my equally-heated objections to CR writing, plotting and pacing (based on my first two tries to watch on homevid -- though several months ago I actually got all the way through it without fast-forwarding), but I still find him so unappealing-looking that I welcome all those shadowy shots. Shooting digital is extremely unflattering on ... hmm, let's be generous, call them textured faces, so the new one will have that issue as well, though with the master Deakins as director of photography, I have to assume matters are well in hand.
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:30 am

trevanian wrote:
Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
trevanian wrote:
As best I can tell, SHE is the reason Craig was selected as Bond, over all sorts of reasonable objections and better candidates, and whatever other calls she makes, THAT is enough for me to really seriously dislike her. No matter how well a Bond film might be made, it still has that uglyass albatross around its neck in the form of Craig, who should be playing LeChiffre's henchman or may-be Felix Leiter.

I wouldn't go that far. It's true she was the only one that wanted Craig, but I don't think he's an albatross. He does bring some things to the table that his predecessors couldn't or wouldn't. Whether those are things you like or dislike is a matter of personal choice.

Yeah, it is a personal choice thing, but for somebody with a 'first-ever-movie-memory' being GOLDFINGER before I turned 4, who saw all of these things multiple times in the theater (except TND and DAD, which I had bad feeling about and skipped till homevid), to completely discount the notion of seeing CR just on the Craig casting, that's a pretty huge reversal.

I mean, I even saw all the Moore pictures (most of which I detested) in the cinema, but the Craig casting was just a bridge too far. It's an incredible tribute to SOME QoS elements that it overcame both my ongoing objections to Craig and my equally-heated objections to CR writing, plotting and pacing (based on my first two tries to watch on homevid -- though several months ago I actually got all the way through it without fast-forwarding), but I still find him so unappealing-looking that I welcome all those shadowy shots. Shooting digital is extremely unflattering on ... hmm, let's be generous, call them textured faces, so the new one will have that issue as well, though with the master Deakins as director of photography, I have to assume matters are well in hand.

His looks don't bother me....anymore. I guess I rank him lower than Moore, Dalton, Brosnan, and Connery because there's not the slightest bit of charm or sophistication about him. He's like a tough guy in a suit, but other than the physique and the physicality he brings to the role (and definitely is more believable as an action-oriented James Bond when watching the films repeatedly), there's not much else to recommend him. I don't want to be swept up in his arms and made love to, so his thuggish good looks and sex-appeal don't work on me. He doesn't have any sense of humor, style or sophistication, so that alienates me from him. And he does not have the sort of constantly annoyed/pissed-off-because-I'm-so-much-smarter-than-everyone-else-in-the-room-sneer that Dalton had (which I liked so much), so I kind of feel like I'm watching a movie *ABOUT* a guy called James Bond, I just haven't felt James Bond's presence in any of the movies so far.

My suspicion is, though, that that was the game-plan all along, no matter who was cast for CR, but Craig worked better for the vision of Bond that Tits O'Broccoli had in mind.
Back to top Go down
trevanian
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1385
Member Since : 2011-03-15
Location : Pac NW

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:47 am

That's quite an interesting notion, one I hadn't considered, and I wonder if years down the line, we'll see it confirmed in somebody's bio. It would prove that Babs, like Cylons and Russians, always has a plan and may not even take a dump without it being firmly in place.

You nailed one of my prime appreciations of Dalton with that sneer thing too, though his 'exasperated with dumb chick but falling for her anyway' variation in TLD probably trumps it for me, because it really fits that line from Fleming or Pearson about Bond being a hard man who could be tipped into sentimentality, which has informed my view of the print and film character since the early 70s when I read everything available.
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:37 am

trevanian wrote:
That's quite an interesting notion, one I hadn't considered, and I wonder if years down the line, we'll see it confirmed in somebody's bio. It would prove that Babs, like Cylons and Russians, always has a plan and may not even take a dump without it being firmly in place.

You nailed one of my prime appreciations of Dalton with that sneer thing too, though his 'exasperated with dumb chick but falling for her anyway' variation in TLD probably trumps it for me, because it really fits that line from Fleming or Pearson about Bond being a hard man who could be tipped into sentimentality, which has informed my view of the print and film character since the early 70s when I read everything available.

I used to refer to LTK as LICENSE REVOKED over at CBn. It drove some people absolutely bat-shit. I haven't done it as much (if at all) over here, but I get the feeling that if I refer to the movie as LICENSE REVOKED you won't mind. LICENSE REVOKED was a perfectly good title, and II don't feel that there's any reason to call Bond 16 by any other name other than LICENSE REVOKED. I'm not one of the pin-heads that the MGM marketing department felt would get the movie confused with a driving flick.

I thought Dalton's exasperated look with Kara when she was getting her cello was perfectly acted. His Bond seemed like a man with limited patience and a short fuse. I think there was a lot more that could have been done to help Dalton achieve his potential, but I don't think the team was in place yet and I think EON had to fail and try again before finding a successful formula that showed a much tougher side to Bond.
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:35 am

GeneralGogol wrote:
While Babs' extracurricular uses of Bond and some of her public statements are troubling, all the post-Cubby films have done well and the Craig era is attracting more publicity and debate around the series than in a long time. She seems to have pissed off some of us, but I see it as more in good humour. Even if the Craig casting or the feminist ad wouldn't have happened, Babs would still be at the centre of attention... it must be her sparkling personality, among other tits things.

Well, it's the tits to. Kind of hard to take the woman seriously as a producer when she's on the set of Casino Royale without a bra, allowing the entire world's press to photograph her talking to Daniel Craig as her nipples jut outwards like the stiff peaks of a baked lemon meringue pie.

To me that's very unprofessional behavior. You never saw Peter Hunt allowing himself to be photographed casually talking to Diana Rigg or any of Blofeld's beauties on the set while sporting a huge woodie in his pants. That's because Hunt was pure class; a professional and a gentleman.
Back to top Go down
Harmsway
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 2801
Member Since : 2011-08-22

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:01 am

Babs was the driving force behind Daniel Craig as Bond. That's enough for me to give her a pass, even though she produced two of the very, very worst Bond films in TWINE and QOS, and has made lots of irritating decisions elsewhere throughout her tenure.


Last edited by Harmsway on Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:16 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
Loomis
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1414
Member Since : 2011-04-12

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:42 am

Harmsway wrote:
Babs was the driving force behind Daniel Craig as Bond. For me, that's enough for me to give her a pass

Exactly.
Back to top Go down
CJB
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3650
Member Since : 2011-03-14
Location : 'Straya

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:07 am

The reason why some fans don't like Babs is because the franchise fell into her lap and she used it as an avenue to promote her own "social justice" agenda. She simply has the wrong mindset when it comes to the works of Ian Fleming.
Back to top Go down
jaguar007
Correspondent
Correspondent
avatar

Posts : 27
Member Since : 2011-08-25
Location : Portland, OR

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:42 pm

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:


To me that's very unprofessional behavior. You never saw Peter Hunt allowing himself to be photographed casually talking to Diana Rigg or any of Blofeld's beauties on the set while sporting a huge woodie in his pants. That's because Hunt was pure class; a professional and a gentleman.

That is because Rigg or Blofeld's beauties would not have given Hunt a "woodie" if you know what I mean.


As for Babs (or Tits if you are GS), she is doing what she needs to do to keep the Bond series alive and well. I understand that many fans may be a bit frustrated with the direction of the franchise. It is going a different direction. Of course the Bond films of the 70s went a very different direction than the Bond films of the 60s--it is what keeps it alive. While some may wish that Babs was out of the picture and it was all Michael, the series might be headed for doom. The Bond series cannot survive on us hardcore fans alone, it needs the support of the average film goer. As I mentioned earlier the Bond films of the 70s were quite different from the Bond films of the 60s, yet the 70s films flourished. The series of the 80s was basically "more of the same" and we saw the numbers dwindle. I think if the Brosnan era had continued throughout the 00 decade, it would have dwindled like the 80s did. Radical change was needed and Babs provided us with the most controversial Bond since the casting of Sean Connery, and like Sean Connery, he paid off in spades. After almost 50 years there is nothing wrong with experimenting with the formula a bit. Sometimes it succeeds like CR, sometimes not as much like QoS. Remember Fleming also changed and experimented with his novels as well.
Back to top Go down
Santa
Senior Correspondent
avatar

Posts : 649
Member Since : 2011-08-21

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:27 pm

CJB wrote:
The reason why some fans don't like Babs is because the franchise fell into her lap and she used it as an avenue to promote her own "social justice" agenda. She simply has the wrong mindset when it comes to the works of Ian Fleming.
So people keep saying but I have yet to see evidence we know what her mindset is, right or wrong. Her own 'social justice' agenda? No-one seems to have been able to explain to me how they know what her agenda is. Nor how suddenly every decision is down to Babs, as if MGW doesn't exist anymore.

I want to make clear that I am not a feminist, not remotely. I like doors help open for me and I wouldn't dream of asking a man out. I'm not desperately defending Babs but I was taught to validate my sources.
Back to top Go down
Loomis
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1414
Member Since : 2011-04-12

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 12:29 am

Santa wrote:
Her own 'social justice' agenda? No-one seems to have been able to explain to me how they know what her agenda is. Nor how suddenly every decision is down to Babs, as if MGW doesn't exist anymore.

I think other action franchises have also become more - for want of a better term - politically correct. In the first LETHAL WEAPON, Mel Gibson makes (with a straight face) a homophobic remark that isn't challenged by anyone. It's impossible to imagine this moment in a modern blockbuster. But come LETHAL WEAPON 4 he's helping illegal immigrants stay in the United States.

In RAMBO: FIRST BLOOD PART II (1985), all Stallone cares about is wasting Vietnamese troops in order to free Americans. However, 2008's RAMBO has him trying to free Americans and liberate Burmese tribespeople.

So it should come as no surprise that QUANTUM OF SOLACE mentions the plight of Haitian sweatshop workers and touches on the evils of big business. Frankly, it's overdue. The problem with QUANTUM OF SOLACE is not its social or political stance - it's that it's a poorly conceived and indifferently executed film with a lack of dramatic focus and a tone that's all over the place.

It's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.
Back to top Go down
Largo's Shark
Moderator
Moderator


Posts : 10600
Member Since : 2011-03-14

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 12:36 am

Loomis wrote:
it's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.

That's likely because most of us us "Babs haters" are fairly right of center, and also view Fleming's Bond as such. We'd rather politics were kept out of Bond, but if's gonna be part of the menu - better it'd be conservative than liberal.
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:57 am

jaguar007 wrote:
Gravity's Silhouette wrote:


To me that's very unprofessional behavior. You never saw Peter Hunt allowing himself to be photographed casually talking to Diana Rigg or any of Blofeld's beauties on the set while sporting a huge woodie in his pants. That's because Hunt was pure class; a professional and a gentleman.

That is because Rigg or Blofeld's beauties would not have given Hunt a "woodie" if you know what I mean.

Oh, okay. I think I know what you mean. :oops:

Well, I'll use a different example then: Alan Cumming. You never saw him in photo-ops with Izzabella Scorupco sporting a huge chubby. He behaved like a gentleman from everything I've ever read and not once ever tried to put the moves on any of his female co-stars. I just have a hunch that Tits McBroccoli wouldn't have dressed like that if her father was still alive and on the set.

Loomis wrote:
Quote :
It's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.

I wasn't really aware of a neocon agenda in DIE ANOTHER DAY; I mean, what is the up-side to living under a regime ruled by Kim Jong-Il? Is is really that controversial a position to suggest that he's dangerous and needs to be eliminated? Also, Brosnan did do some environmental awareness ads, if I recall correctly, but they were as Brosnan, not as Bond, and they were less off-putting and more inviting; instead of trying to bully people and guilt them into joining his group, Brosnan tried to appeal to their better instincts, something in woefully short supply in the Bond In Drag/EQUALS ad.

Santa wrote:
Quote :
So people keep saying but I have yet to see evidence we know what her mindset is, right or wrong. Her own 'social justice' agenda? No-one seems to have been able to explain to me how they know what her agenda is. Nor how suddenly every decision is down to Babs, as if MGW doesn't exist anymore.

She did an interview several years ago where she tried defending Bond Girls as somehow progressive and enlightening and forward thinking, and her compatriots in the movement wouldn't go along with it. Two and a half years later she comes out with an ad that she helped produce that shows Bond in a woman's dress....and stockings....and wig....trying to understand what it feels like to be a woman in 2011 (would not be surprised to find out that Craig was wearing a maxi-pad underneath that dress so he could really get into character). Just from that alone you don't see any signal or indication that she's part of a feminist movement?

As for every decision now being hers and not MGW...well, all I can say to that is she has eclipsed him as of late in doing interviews and speaking to the press. There was a time when MGW was literally the face of the management team (especially as Cubby got older) and you almost never saw Barbra doing commentary or interviews for the dvd releases or promotional materials. But that all changed a few years ago. Not saying that's good or bad, but simply noting that it has changed.

Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest
avatar


PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:10 am

Sharky wrote:
Loomis wrote:
it's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.

That's likely because most of us us "Babs haters" are fairly right of center, and also view Fleming's Bond as such. We'd rather politics were kept out of Bond, but if's gonna be part of the menu - better it'd be conservative than liberal.

Don't think it's that easy. Conservative today means something else than it meant 60 years ago. And it will mean something else in 60 years again. Fleming said so himself in his first. Doubt he'd even recognise any of today's parties.
Back to top Go down
Santa
Senior Correspondent
avatar

Posts : 649
Member Since : 2011-08-21

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:27 am

Kennon wrote:
Sharky wrote:
Loomis wrote:
it's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.

That's likely because most of us us "Babs haters" are fairly right of center, and also view Fleming's Bond as such. We'd rather politics were kept out of Bond, but if's gonna be part of the menu - better it'd be conservative than liberal.

Don't think it's that easy. Conservative today means something else than it meant 60 years ago. And it will mean something else in 60 years again. Fleming said so himself in his first. Doubt he'd even recognise any of today's parties.
It also means something very different in Europe to what it means in America.
Back to top Go down
Santa
Senior Correspondent
avatar

Posts : 649
Member Since : 2011-08-21

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:30 am

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
She did an interview several years ago where she tried defending Bond Girls as somehow progressive and enlightening and forward thinking, and her compatriots in the movement wouldn't go along with it. Two and a half years later she comes out with an ad that she helped produce that shows Bond in a woman's dress....and stockings....and wig....trying to understand what it feels like to be a woman in 2011 (would not be surprised to find out that Craig was wearing a maxi-pad underneath that dress so he could really get into character). Just from that alone you don't see any signal or indication that she's part of a feminist movement?
I'm afraid it's not quite enough to justify some of the vitriol I've seen thrown her way, no. I note that those who in other threads have expressed particularly strong feelings against her mostly haven't contributed here.
Back to top Go down
Santa
Senior Correspondent
avatar

Posts : 649
Member Since : 2011-08-21

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:39 am

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
Well, I'll use a different example then: Alan Cumming. You never saw him in photo-ops with Izzabella Scorupco sporting a huge chubby. He behaved like a gentleman from everything I've ever read and not once ever tried to put the moves on any of his female co-stars. I just have a hunch that Tits McBroccoli wouldn't have dressed like that if her father was still alive and on the set.
:D Oh come on, it's not quite the same. I seriously doubt her 'bullets' were an indication of any feelings towards Daniel Craig or anyone else, more just that she was cold. We can't help that and I think you may find yours do the same ;) . As for blaming the way she's dressed, well she's hardly done up for standing on street corners and if she were really trying to show off the goods, she wouldn't have worn that outfit, any of it. Yes, she could have done with a bra but not everyone finds them comfortable - maybe she'd been wearing one in the morning but the strap had bust by lunchtime and she had to take it off and didn't have a spare :roll: (it happens and most women don't carry spare bras around with them), maybe she had stitches on a wound at the point where the strap sits so it would rub and she had to go without... The list could go on, these are just two examples taken from personal experience. Making a stick to beat her with out of one unfortunate picture is really, really petty.
Back to top Go down
Loomis
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1414
Member Since : 2011-04-12

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:22 am

Gravity's Silhouette wrote:
I wasn't really aware of a neocon agenda in DIE ANOTHER DAY; I mean, what is the up-side to living under a regime ruled by Kim Jong-Il? Is is really that controversial a position to suggest that he's dangerous and needs to be eliminated?

I don't disagree with you about North Korea, but when I say that DIE ANOTHER DAY has a neocon agenda I mean that it seems to chime very well with the then-current Bush/Blair view of the world, i.e. communist countries are evil (except for China, which the West must work with rather than invade, possibly because it has the mightiest military on earth and could open up a huge can of whupass on us, unlike piddly little Cuba), "terrorists" are poised to destroy the world, rogue states are developing WMD, America and Britain are the world's top good guys and world policemen, etc. You can't call that a liberal agenda, as is found in QUANTUM OF SOLACE. DAD is a conservative Bond film, whereas QoS is a liberal one.

Incidentally, I don't care about the political agenda of a Bond film one way or another. My own political stance is probably rather more liberal than conservative (although like most of us I guess I'm conservative on some issues and liberal on others), but I much prefer DAD as a film to QoS. I don't judge my Bond flicks on their politics.
Back to top Go down
CJB
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3650
Member Since : 2011-03-14
Location : 'Straya

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:31 am

Loomis wrote:

So it should come as no surprise that QUANTUM OF SOLACE mentions the plight of Haitian sweatshop workers and touches on the evils of big business. Frankly, it's overdue.

I hardly see how it was "overdue". Plenty of movies are made about the supposed evils of big business. Bond movies, however, don't exist to promote soppy social messages.

Loomis wrote:

It's also curious that the anti-Babs brigade seems to deliberately ignore DIE ANOTHER DAY, which if anything has a neocon agenda.

It's difficult to attribute a poltiical message to a film about a giant killer satelite made of diamonds, a magic face-changing machine, and an invisible car. DAD doesn't take itself nearly as seriously as QOS does. The poltiics weren't nearly as in-your-face.

In any case, a year out from 9/11, one would expect a "neocon" film to be about Islamist terrorists, not a North Korean who pulls a Michael Jackson.
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:47 am

CJB wrote:


In any case, a year out from 9/11, one would expect a "neocon" film to be about Islamist terrorists, not a North Korean who pulls a Michael Jackson.

You would expect such a film, but you'd be very disappointed. Hollywood is very averse to stereotyping Muslims as terrorists and will go out of their way to avoid making them the villains of any movie.
Back to top Go down
trevanian
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1385
Member Since : 2011-03-15
Location : Pac NW

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:55 am

^Isn't that how SUM OF ALL FEARS wound up with Alan Bates as a neo-nazi villain? And that was shot prior to 9/11, even if it released after.

Makes me think of how they changed the baddies in the long-forgotten 70s terrorists kidnap heiresses flick from Preminger called ROSEBUD (y'know, the one where Mitchum plays a CIA agent but gets fired for being drunk on-set, so they replace him with Peter O'Toole as a CIA agent), which went from arab terrorists to arabs being (mis)led by an English anarchist (played by Richard Attenborough in something like a white sheet, after production failed to entice Hitchcock to play the part.)
Back to top Go down
Gravity's Silhouette
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 3852
Member Since : 2011-04-16
Location : Inside my safe space

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:10 am

trevanian wrote:
^Isn't that how SUM OF ALL FEARS wound up with Alan Bates as a neo-nazi villain? And that was shot prior to 9/11, even if it released after.

Yep. I shudder to think of what Ed Zwick is going to do to Vince Flynn's Mitch Rapp series.
Back to top Go down
trevanian
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1385
Member Since : 2011-03-15
Location : Pac NW

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:40 am

I have a feeling it will lack GLORY, as has nearly all of Zwick's post GLORY efforts (well, I have a soft spot for THE SIEGE, just for the cellphone moment and Tony Shalhoub.)
Back to top Go down
Loomis
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
avatar

Posts : 1414
Member Since : 2011-04-12

PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:42 am

CJB wrote:
It's difficult to attribute a poltiical message to a film about a giant killer satelite made of diamonds, a magic face-changing machine, and an invisible car. DAD doesn't take itself nearly as seriously as QOS does. The poltiics weren't nearly as in-your-face.

True. I'm not saying that DAD was made in order to trumpet a political message, but that if one were inclined to speculate on the film's political worldview it would seem reasonable to call it neoconish. But, yes, it's less self-important and stridently political than QoS.

CJB wrote:
In any case, a year out from 9/11, one would expect a "neocon" film to be about Islamist terrorists

Nah, it would have been too soon and would have left a nasty taste. But there's still that shoehorned-in line from M, "While you were away, the world changed", so 9/11 still hangs over the film, rather awkwardly and self-consciously.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?   

Back to top Go down
 
Can someone please explain to me the Babs hate?
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 2 of 4Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Bond And Beyond :: Bond :: Bond: General News & General Discussion-
Jump to: