Last Bond Movie You Watched.

I think most react to the old school adventure/India locale flourishes of MacDonald Frasier and the overconvoluted plot along with the more relaxed pacing/tone. Either people like it or they don't with OP.

I think it really needed fleshing out in the connection between Orlov and Khan's plans converging most of all but otherwise is far better than its undeserved reputation and is grand old fashioned entertainment with some great stunt work and a fantastic Cold War scenario with Orlov's plan which is really the best part of the film.

Best moments: Acrostar pts, Auction house scene, Magda's balcony exit, Roger in everything, Glen's construction of each setpiece is perfection, Cold War elements, Berkoff's performance, and a great soundmix for 1983.

But for me the absolute best moments are without a doubt the Soviet conference, Bond and Octopussy coupling and discussing Bond's character, the sudden reveal of the bomb, Bond's confrontation of Orlov, one of the best horse transfers ever filmed when Bond jumps to the plane and the iconic banister slide.

If you can't see Bond sliding down an ornate banister firing away with an AK-47 and not smile as widely as Barry's score knowingly pumps up the musical cue then you are dead inside. THAT is what we do not have currently: the magic, the spark of life, the iconic mixture of intelligent sparkle and class.


The only thing to take out is the damn PIGEONS and Glen trademark jump scares. IT'S NOT NECESSARY TO DO IT IN EVERY FILM AT MULTIPLE POINTS AAAAAAAAH! I love Glen, think he is agonizingly undervalued but HATE HATE HATE his insistence on these jumps in all five films.

Solid write up Hilly. What I like most about Moore's 80s film is the return to fleshed out characters and humanised situations. Bond's pursuit of Orlov and his soldiers feels a lot more grounded than much of the 70s films.

Goldeneye - did notice this time round that an hour elapses between the first 2 major action sequences involving Bond (the pre-credits sequence and the escape from Ouromov's clutches/tank chase/escape from Janus' train) and couldn't help but get a little twitchily impatient as a result. Also, what is up with Natalya's cry of 'Xenia!' as she slaps Alec for his attempts to force himself on her ... is she hoping for some sort of female solidarity from her co-captor?

Those things said, still Brosnan's most solid of his 4 IMO.

Blunt Instrument wrote:

Goldeneye - did notice this time round that an hour elapses between the first 2 major action sequences involving Bond (the pre-credits sequence and the escape from Ouromov's clutches/tank chase/escape from Janus' train) and couldn't help but get a little twitchily impatient as a result. Also, what is up with Natalya's cry of 'Xenia!' as she slaps Alec for his attempts to force himself on her ... is she hoping for some sort of female solidarity from her co-captor?  

Those things said, still Brosnan's most solid of his 4 IMO.      

But there is so much intrigue instead... And not sure she says "Xenia"...

It sounds very like it, though.

Whilst we're in that area, have always wondered what that 'Breeetch!' thing is that Xenia comes out with a couple of times when angered. I know Google could likely tell me within a minute or so, but where's the fun in that ... does anyone here know?

Presumably it's some sort of expletive, maybe one that in English would've lost GE its 12A/PG-13 rating.

"Blyat" literally translates to "whore" but is generally used in the manner one might exclaim "fuck/damn it!"

Ah, I see. Thank you, sir.

CJB wrote:

"Blyat" literally translates to "whore" but is generally used in the manner one might exclaim "fuck/damn it!"

I recall even when it aired on TV they would edit that out. It wasn't common for American TV airings to censor foreign curse words.

Gotta protect the sweet innocent ears of THE CHILDRENS!

Also amusing is that the version of GE with the Xenia/Natalya and Bond/Alec headbutts included bumps its age classification up to 15 from 12.

Censors, eh?

Funny thing is that production actually shot footage of Alec's head taking the bullet by Ourumov in the PTS, but was ultimately cut out to retain less restrictive film ratings. If retained, it would have made the orchestration behind his defection more confusing.

Alec: "Hey, Orumov."
Orumov: *eyes widen, takes a swig from flask*
Alec: "Back from the dead. No longer just an anonymous star on the Memorial Wall at MI6."
Orumov: "I SHOT YOU IN THE HEAD!!!"
Alec: "I'm running the Janus Syndicate. Wanna join in on my scheme?"
Orumov: "I SHOT YOU IN THE HEAD!!!"
Alec: "We've got free booze."
Orumov: "...I'm in."

Yeah ... how Alec survives that has always been pretty hazy. I don't know if we're meant to assume that Ouromov had been collaborating with him from the start and therefore Ouromov's gun is loaded with blanks AND live rounds (hence how he is able to shoot one of his troops dead shortly afterwards), or if we're meant to think Alec was Ouromov's enemy, took a live round at point-blank range to the head and lived.

If the latter, definitely the most awkward recruitment.

"I know you shot me point blank in the head, but I think you'll make a great addition to Janus!"

It's better they cut out the live round to the head, so it makes you believe they were in on it from the beginning. They probably should have cut out the bit with Oroumov shooting his soldier to run with the blank idea, but I guess they wanted to really show how devious he was.

Yeah, it's been almost 25 years and yet there's still so much of the film that could do with an explanation from the writers.

I like to think that a blank was used on Ouromov's soldier too. All part of the defection. I think it's pretty clear that the operation was used to stage Trevelyan's betrayal.

Tons and tons of rewrites can show some of the creaks. I assume the heist job that Bond was describing to Valentin was actually going to be something we'd witness before being reduced to exposition before more info dump about Lienz Cossacks. Trevelyan's motive in the earlier drafts is more clean as he was a much older character who actually witnessed the British betrayal, as opposed to being a small boy who witnessed his father commit suicide a decade or two after the betrayal. It's flimsy in the final film, but Bean sells it through his performance.

Makeshift Python wrote:

Tons and tons of rewrites can show some of the creaks. I assume the heist job that Bond was describing to Valentin was actually going to be something we'd witness before being reduced to exposition before more info dump about Lienz Cossacks. Trevelyan's motive in the earlier drafts is more clean as he was a much older character who actually witnessed the British betrayal, as opposed to being a small boy who witnessed his father commit suicide a decade or two after the betrayal. It's flimsy in the final film, but Bean sells it through his performance.

Kevin Wade was hired to "streamline" the film and he has described the heist as one of those instances where an entire sequence was reduced to one scene.

And from memory, Augustus didn't survive passed France's draft, and it was Caine's idea for Trevelyan to be younger and then give him the Lienz Cossack backstory.

FieldsMan wrote:

And from memory, Augustus didn't survive passed France's draft, and it was Caine's idea for Trevelyan to be younger and then give him the Lienz Cossack backstory.

It's been a long time since I've read the first draft, but I'm surprised if the Lienz Cossack backstory was added AFTER making Trevelyan younger.

FieldsMan wrote:

I like to think that a blank was used on Ouromov's soldier too. All part of the defection. I think it's pretty clear that the operation was used to stage Trevelyan's betrayal.

It's admittedly quick, but a bullet-hole can be seen appearing in the soldier's chest. Which forces us to consider that Ouromov was some sort of psychic and he knew that circumstances that called on him to appear to shoot one of his own would occur, so he had him fitted with a 'squib' and told him to make sure he was standing behind him.

inspired mostly by Fields, (but also reading Lycett's book on Fleming which I promptly lost on a train last night) I jumped away from the Moore era to FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE

I won't wax much about it beyond what Fields has said. So on this viewing I decided to look at it a little differently. Connery, maybe I'm reading much into it, has like in my recent viewings of GF/TB has some great expressions that convey much. Most occur in the pre-fight scene with Grant -Bond's both annoyed at his predicament but also able to remark on the brilliance of the SPECTRE plan (something that crops up in Goldfinger of course -"I have to hand it to you...").

I wasn't too swayed by Bianchi (or rather, perhaps that should be, her dubber…) in the film. I don't expect Meryl Streep but in parts I just can't buy her.

Musically a triumph except...well, I'm a huge fan of the Bond theme (hence why Skyfall in part worked for me) and yet it's out of place when Bond checks his room over.

There is something about Grant suddenly interested in gold sovereigns. Part of me wonders if he is the kind of person to be swayed by it. Granted Bond is perhaps edging on desperate to do anything to turn the tables but "I have gold sovereigns.../Where?/" seems, I can't phrase it but out of sorts. Grant just does not strike me as the kind to be interested in such things. He's a cold blooded killer who from the start doesn't really seem swayed by material things.

But here you note the editing of Hunt which seems subtle compared to TB/OHMSS. I never twigged until tonight how people suddenly run faster in the gypsy camp battle or whatever.

And what about Gotell during the boat scene when the fires all over- "get rid of it! get rid of it!". Rid of what? The fire? How?

But, as much as I said I wouldn't bang on, what a brilliant film. To mould an Austin Powers quote, isn't it funny how Scotland looks no way like Yugoslavia?

(Edit, and yes Fields, as attractive a woman as she was, Lois Maxwell looked her best in this film. Love that little scene with all the service heads listening to Bond's tape).

FieldsMan wrote:

Makeshift Python wrote:

Tons and tons of rewrites can show some of the creaks. I assume the heist job that Bond was describing to Valentin was actually going to be something we'd witness before being reduced to exposition before more info dump about Lienz Cossacks. Trevelyan's motive in the earlier drafts is more clean as he was a much older character who actually witnessed the British betrayal, as opposed to being a small boy who witnessed his father commit suicide a decade or two after the betrayal. It's flimsy in the final film, but Bean sells it through his performance.

Kevin Wade was hired to "streamline" the film and he has described the heist as one of those instances where an entire sequence was reduced to one scene.

And from memory, Augustus didn't survive passed France's draft, and it was Caine's idea for Trevelyan to be younger and then give him the Lienz Cossack backstory.

Good lord are these available to read somewhere!?!?!?!!!!

FRWL is the most subtle and refined of the series arguably. It not only uses the Hitchcock inspiration but builds upon it to make a supreme cocktail of Fleming realized on the screen. This is why is is the best of the series as a standalone film.

I love Barbara Jefford's voice in the dub with the stock Russian accent being just perfect but would agree the film makes Tania seem a bit docile coming from Fleming's masterfully realized characterization-but the film improves on the stealing of the decoding machine instead throwing it away.
But the gorgeous Miss Bianchi is simply stunning and infuses a certain charm to many scenes that makes the central crux of the story so fantastic it just might be true.

The sovereigns are Grant's greed and base animal instincts getting the better of him. It is only his psychological defects that do him in as otherwise Bond has had it. This is the best scene in the entire series for good reason and this is only one of the many reasons why.

I don't think there are many of Hunt's frame chops going on-really only in making the fighting fish work. It's more of fast pacing and editing saves like Klebb in Blofeld's office etc. The only thing I hate is the last shot in the training area to give scale but is actually shows them walking through again in the same area!

Perhaps Morenzy was talking about a big crate of rifle grenades?


Agreed 100% on Moneypenny. I'd argue OHMSS is perhaps the best overall but FRWL is the definitive office scene with the "Let me tell you the secret of the world" banter and just enough knowing sexual charge to energize the scene with even more personality than Penny's obvious care for 007 in DN. This is beautifully capped off by the return of the photograph where Bond jokingly inscribes it with the film's title.

The real Bond says Ciao. Always and forever.
The abomination simply understands nothing and does POUTFACE.

I didn't think about the rifle grenades on the boat. Wouldn't have made any difference had they gone I'd imagine.

I might have to rewatch the film later and review Tanya.

Sovereigns or not, good scene for the reasons you give Boot.

Makeshift Python wrote:

FieldsMan wrote:

And from memory, Augustus didn't survive passed France's draft, and it was Caine's idea for Trevelyan to be younger and then give him the Lienz Cossack backstory.

It's been a long time since I've read the first draft, but I'm surprised if the Lienz Cossack backstory was added AFTER making Trevelyan younger.

Yeah, the whole backstory to Trevelyan feels like an afterthought in the final film. Even if you suspend disbelief as one typically would for a Bond film, you're being asked to believe that the 35 year old spawn of Nazi-collaborating, primitive horsefolk somehow ended up in England in the middle of the Cold War, went to the "right schools," and was recruited to MI6 without a hitch? And then as revenge for his father's suicide, he wants to destroy the UK's financial system with a space laser? But it's not just that, he also wants to be "richer than God" which is exactly what you'd expect someone supposedly from a fundamentalist Orthodox Christian background to say.

They could've ditched all that and possibly had Alec's bitterness towards the situation Bond left him in ('headshot' not necessary, I daresay being left behind in an exploding chemical weapons plant is anger-making enough) as his motivation and had him target MI6 specifically rather than London generically (although that would've left TWINE needing a different story, granted).