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Klown
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Mon Mar 21, 2011 2:22 am

ambler wrote:
Did Written on the Wind?
Off-topic, but that's an absolutely amazing film.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Wed Mar 23, 2011 2:34 pm

The White Tuxedo wrote:
ambler wrote:
What's your favourite example of a film noir?

Anyway, for me it's Out of the Past .


Yes! In some ways OUT OF THE PAST is my favorite movie. It's hard to explain, but I seem to love every second of it. It's not really my favorite film, but I just love it. And it's the perfect noir to me.

Yep, you can put me down for some of this too. A long-time fave this one. As for explaining why, obviously the alluring and perfectly-rendered noir elements speak for themselves, but I think Mitchum is a big distinguishing factor; His hangdog features and seemingly "average guy" inferiority when in a room with someone like Kirk Douglas helps lend him a certain vulnerability, a sense of identification, compared to, say, Bogart, who, when in a room with anyone, utterly owns the room, he's number one, even when he's outnumbered, you'll know he has a way out up his sleeve. When we meet Mitchum at the start of Out Of The Past, he's just basically an average Joe like you or I, going about his boring business and regular dreary day-to-day life in the garage. And when he's recognised, we're instantly fascinated and curious as to what secret past Mitchum has been running from; It's a dependably nostalgic/romantic element, one being drawn back into one's past, both professional and personal, especially when told through the eyes (and of course the reliably intimate voiceover) of a seemingly regular Joe with whom we can identify. I can all too well understand somebody citing this as their favourite film, because for me it's right up there with the best of 'em.

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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:17 pm

I said favorite movie, not film. If that makes sense. laugh

Love RKO.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:55 pm

The White Tuxedo wrote:
I said favorite movie, not film. If that makes sense. laugh

Okay, yep. :oops:
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Wed Mar 23, 2011 4:38 pm

Lazenby. wrote:
The White Tuxedo wrote:
I said favorite movie, not film. If that makes sense. laugh

Okay, yep. :oops:

I just mean it's my favorite movie. Like my favorite movie just to watch, if that makes sense. Along with ONLY ANGELS HAVE WINGS, RIO BRAVO, THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE, and maybe POINT BLANK.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:14 pm

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PostSubject: The Noir Thread (& Crime Drama)   Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:41 pm

Pickup On South Street
vintage Richard Widmark as the cynical pickpocket who inadvertently becomes involved in an espionage caper
Jean Peters is the feisty dame who eventually succumbs to his dubious charms
while Thelma Ritter delivers a memorable supporting roll as the local snitch


Seve, I merged your thread into the original - Colly.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:22 am

Back in the Film Noir mood after the release of a certain videogame. Watched Touch of Evil and then engaged some curiousity and watched the 1945 RKO B-movie version of Dick Tracy with Morgan Conway. My grandfather passed away a week ago and Tracy was his favourite comics character. The movie was low-budget but surprisingly stylish and exciting. It has noirish sensibilities although it's far more in the police procedural genre. I ended up enjoying it far more than the Warren Beatty verison though.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sat Jun 11, 2011 9:12 am

Seve wrote:
Pickup On South Street
vintage Richard Widmark as the cynical pickpocket who inadvertently becomes involved in an espionage caper
Jean Peters is the feisty dame who eventually succumbs to his dubious charms
while Thelma Ritter delivers a memorable supporting roll as the local snitch


Seve, I merged your thread into the original - Colly.

thanks,
I was particularly facinated by Widmarks abode in this film,
from one perspective a one room wooden shack with no plumbing in the docklands
on the other hand, being at the end of a jetty, up on pilings over the water, with the beer cooling in a crate on the end of a rope down under the water... when he was reclining on a sleeping bag on the floating side deck, out under the stars, as the girl comes down the steps... I almost wished I could live there...
8)
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:36 am

I daresay in winter it wouldve been a terrible place to live. ;)

But apart from that, I agree its a nifty shack. Pity he couldnt get a better bird than Jean Peters to come there...
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:47 am

colly wrote:
I daresay in winter it wouldve been a terrible place to live. ;)

But apart from that, I agree its a nifty shack. Pity he couldnt get a better bird than Jean Peters to come there...

and I forgot to mention the hamock, always a cool accessory... although it must be tricky when you've got company... hence the sleeping bag outside on the more stable outside deck

I seem to be having a completely unintentional Jean Peters season at the moment, having just seen her as a female swashbuckler in "Ann Of The Indies" as well

I think her tomboy type fits with Widmarks prickly persona quite well, you'd have to be a bit thick skinned to put up with most of the characters he plays
laugh
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:37 am

Seve wrote:
I think her tomboy type fits with Widmarks prickly persona quite well, you'd have to be a bit thick skinned to put up with most of the characters he plays
laugh

You ought to see Joanne Dru in MY PAL GUS - she turns him into a complete softie, which is as heartwarming as it is hilarious. :cheers:
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:52 am

Pepe le Moco (1936)
one of the classic crime fiction films ever made and a fantastic time capsule containing the distilled exotic ambience of French colonial Algiers
like many French movie stars, Jean Gabin is no oil painting, but he does have a certain energy and charisma
and he needs to in order to avoid being upstaged by the colourful menagerie of supporting players who surround him
wanted by the French authorities, master criminal Pepe le Moco and his gang take refuge in the seamy labyrinth of the Algiers Casbah, where the police can never quite catch up with them, but slowly his sanctuary becomes his prison...
meanwhile the wily local inspector bides his time until a woman provides the flashpoint that could prove to be Pepe's undoing
if you have enjoyed the feel of Casablanca you may well fall in love with this one


Last edited by Seve on Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:02 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Jul 17, 2011 4:21 pm

Looking for something to do, I consulted my films lists and made a list of everyf ilm that I'd seen that had a noirish feel to it - with added requirements of being both black and white and in the classic noir (I only had 4 post-1955 and I wouldnt categorise any of them as pure noir) period. From that list I made a top 10 of films that are both the best of their kind, and that I identify as noir, above all other kinds of genres.

The list went:

1. DOUBLE INDEMNITY Dir. Billy Wilder, 1944
2. IN A LONELY PLACE Dir. Nicholas Ray, 1950
3. THEY LIVE BY NIGHT Dir. Nicholas Ray, 1948
4. THE POSTMAN ALWAYS RINGS TWICE Dir. Tay Garnett, 1946
5. MILDRED PIERCE Dir. Michael Curtiz, 1945
6. LAURA Dir. Otto Preminger, 1944
7. ON DANGEROUS GROUND Dir. Nicholas Ray, 1952
8. THE BIG HEAT Dir. Fritz Lang, 1953
9. ACT OF VIOLENCE Dir. Fred Zinnemann, 1948
10. MURDER, MY SWEET Dir. Edward Dmytryk, 1945

With 5 that would have made it, except that I dont consider them primarily as films noir....

THE MALTESE FALCON - it kickstarted the genre/style for sure, especially in its use of the seductively dangerous woman, but its more of a supercool extension of the Warners gangster flicks from the 30s, with Bogie as a new leading man and private eyes instead of gangsters and cops.

KISS ME DEADLY - more of an atomic age detective story that has some noir features, kind of a post-noir MALTESE FALCON.

SWEET SMELL OF SUCCESS - Sydney's a typically noirish doomed ladder-climber, but its sizzle comes from its stylish satire.

THE KILLING - heist film, despite the presence of the dangerously seductive female and men looking to get something better.

ACE IN THE HOLE - maybe because I was so overpowered with anger from watching this film than anything else.

Feel free to give me an argument, a rec for a new film or a rewatch, or whether you think those non-noirs are real noirs.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Jul 17, 2011 5:25 pm

KISS ME DEADLY not noir? I'd absolutely count this as being firmly noir.

As for my Top 10? I don't know if I could do one. I know I like OUT OF THE PAST, IN A LONELY PLACE, KISS ME DEADLY, DOUBLE INDEMNITY, GUN CRAZY, and I'll throw in THE BIG COMBO. THE BIG COMBO is simply lodged in my brain. It's on Netflix Instant now too, which is cool. My DVD copy is at PAL speed.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Jul 17, 2011 5:36 pm

KISS ME DEADLY feels very modern to me, which is very much part of its charm - as opposed to most of the noirs here which belong in more 40s locations - places where, to paraphrase Chandler, the streets arent just darkened by the night. Just the feel of the piece for me.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Jul 17, 2011 5:49 pm

It's more modern, but it's totally noir. It's sorta the final exponent of noir before TOUCH OF EVIL.

I found this. Noir in Technicolor:

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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Jul 17, 2011 5:55 pm

Full films...


STRANGE ILLUSION. I've wanted to see this. Directed by Edgar Ulmer, the same year he did the cultastic DETOUR.



FEAR IN THE NIGHT, starring The Real Dr. McCoy.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Fri Jul 22, 2011 9:29 am

colly wrote:
Looking for something to do, I consulted my films lists and made a list of everyf ilm that I'd seen that had a noirish feel to it - with added requirements of being both black and white and in the classic noir (I only had 4 post-1955 and I wouldnt categorise any of them as pure noir) period. From that list I made a top 10 of films that are both the best of their kind, and that I identify as noir, above all other kinds of genres...
...Feel free to give me an argument, a rec for a new film or a rewatch, or whether you think those non-noirs are real noirs.

sad to say, I've only seen 3 of the films in your Top 10
so I can see I still have many enjoyable (or should that be harrowing) hours of entertainment ahead

film noir / crime fiction, personally I choose to employ a broad / loose definition
using a list by "The New Yorker" that I found, as a basis
in no particular order
"Out Of The Past" - as I favour "man in a raincoat" movies over the other varieties
"The Big Sleep" - I much prefer to "The Maltese Falcon" where I feel Bogart just talks too much for my taste and Elisha Cook jr doesn't generate the physical menace required from his part
"This Gun For Hire" - Alan Ladd in the raincoat this time
"Strangers On A Train" - Hitchcock at his best
"The Big Clock" - Ray Milland in another Hitchcockian noir, except not by Hitch
"The Lady From Shanghai" - Orson Wells, Rita Hayworth, shades of "The Great Gastby" and "The Talented Mr Ripley" now that's entertainment!
"Pickup On South Street" - Richard Widmark makes the perfect ambivalent noir protagonist (he's outstanding in "Kiss Of Death" too but pure evil in that one)
"Double Indemnity" - a fine example of the scheming couples variety
"The Killing" - a fine example of the heist variety
"Bob The High Roller" - the French were pretty good at this too, JP Melville at the top of his form
"Pepe Le Moco" - French again and that's makes eleven (doh!)

The White Tuxedo wrote:
KISS ME DEADLY not noir? I'd absolutely count this as being firmly noir.
As for my Top 10? I don't know if I could do one. I know I like OUT OF THE PAST, IN A LONELY PLACE, KISS ME DEADLY, DOUBLE INDEMNITY, GUN CRAZY, and I'll throw in THE BIG COMBO. THE BIG COMBO is simply lodged in my brain. It's on Netflix Instant now too, which is cool. My DVD copy is at PAL speed.
colly wrote:
KISS ME DEADLY feels very modern to me, which is very much part of its charm - as opposed to most of the noirs here which belong in more 40s locations - places where, to paraphrase Chandler, the streets arent just darkened by the night. Just the feel of the piece for me.

"Kiss Me Deadly" was very enjoyable but I guess I just prefer my protagonist to be a more likeable person then Ralph Meeker

The Big Combo? (would you like extra fries with that?)

The Big Combo
"This violent, dark film tells of tormented Police Lt. Leonard Diamond (Cornel Wilde), who is on a personal crusade to bring down sadistic gangster Mr. Brown (Richard Conte). He's also dangerously obsessed with Brown's girlfriend (Jean Wallace), his captive lover."

sounds promising!
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:08 am

About THE BIG COMBO: It's C-grade and trashy, but I still find it fascinating.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:03 am

I'm prepping a new script so thought I would dust off this thread. It dates back to the days when we talked about films other than comic books and Star Trek/Wars.

Anyone reckon 'Where the Truth Lies' qualifies as noir? I wouldn't have thought so, so am somewhat surprised by Ebert's review:

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051027/REVIEWS/50928007/1023
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:30 pm

I can't really comment on that film as I haven't seen it yet.

But I'm glad you revived this thread, as noir is still one of my favorite genres.

The best noir I saw in the past year or so was "The Big Heat".
Jocelyn Brando's character (the wife of the main protagonist) is one of the more interesting I've seen in a noir, and she manages it all in just a couple of scenes.

It's noteworthy that the strongest female character I got introduced to this year is a 1950s housewife. Rather puts all of EONs Jane Bond attempts into perspective. The scene where Bannion describes his wife to the dying Gloria Grahame is genuinely moving.

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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Oct 28, 2012 10:48 pm

Salomé wrote:
It's noteworthy that the strongest female character I got introduced to this year is a 1950s housewife

Perhaps that's only notable because feminism has spent the last 40+ years denigrating the housewife and with it much of female history. Keeping a family together is one of the hardest jobs to do, but I guess that discussion belongs to another thread.

Coming back to film noir and what defines it, I'm still trying to work out exactly what the genre encompasses. I rewatched Sean Penn's The Pledge the other day, first time I've seen it for 10 years. It certainly has elements of noir, but is it? Damned if I know.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Oct 28, 2012 11:05 pm

I wouldn't consider The Pledge a noir in the purest sense, though it does have some noir elements.
A better comparison would probably be Fritz Lang's "M". Which isn't a noir itself but has many noir elements and was directed by a man who defined many of the genre's basic traits.
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PostSubject: Re: The Film Noir Thread   Sun Oct 28, 2012 11:10 pm

Salomé wrote:
the genre's basic traits.

In the opening post I said noir should contain:

• Deep shadow photography

• A voice over

• A tough but none-too-bright (fall)guy/anti-hero.

• A smart and sexy femme fatale to lure said anti-hero to his doom

• Flashbacks

• A downbeat ending…

Is that right?








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