No Time to Die - Spoiler Free Reviews

Casting a person of color as Bond is very different from casting a white guy with dirty blonde hair. The fundamental level of identity difference is far greater. And, given the current anti-white climate, that is almost certainly what Babs will do.

Perilagu Khan wrote:

Casting a person of color as Bond is very different from casting a white guy with dirty blonde hair.  

Agreed, though I've been wondering whether Craig's casting has inadvertently pushed the Overton window, so to speak. James Bond always had a traditional mould - tall, dark (hair that is), and classically handsome. Despite the initial controversy, Craig's ultimate success (though I may regard him as massively overrated) now means EON will no longer feel obliged to limit candidates to the those which we may have regarded as "looking like James Bond" in a bygone era.

I mean, think back to Brosnan's departure where the likes of Clive Owen and Henry Cavill were being touted, i.e. men who could conceivably have been Sean Connery's sons or Timothy Dalton's nephews. No one was seriously suggesting a non-white Bond back then, granted the current political and cultural climate is so far gone now that the early Noughties may as well have been a century ago.

Cavill is 38, a 6-footer, handsome, dark-haired with some very slight greying, has been in a Mission : Impossible flick and the recent big-screen Man From UNCLE and made it to the last 2 the last time Bond was being cast. Incredible to think that all this could actually count AGAINST him getting it this time round, rather than being the prime candidate.

The Man From UNCLE movie was in many ways more reminiscent of classic Bond films than many of the more recent Bond flicks have been.
Which sort of rubbishes the notion you can no longer make those types of movies.

But Cavill as Bond seems like a long-shot to me. The experience of being attached to a large franchise over a longer period of time, playing an iconic character is something he has already done and supposedly did not enjoy very much (Superman).

CJB wrote:

Perilagu Khan wrote:

Casting a person of color as Bond is very different from casting a white guy with dirty blonde hair.  

Agreed, though I've been wondering whether Craig's casting has inadvertently pushed the Overton window, so to speak. James Bond always had a traditional mould - tall, dark (hair that is), and classically handsome. Despite the initial controversy, Craig's ultimate success (though I may regard him as massively overrated) now means EON will no longer feel obliged to limit candidates to the those which we may have regarded as "looking like James Bond" in a bygone era.

I mean, think back to Brosnan's departure where the likes of Clive Owen and Henry Cavill were being touted, i.e. men who could conceivably have been Sean Connery's sons or Timothy Dalton's nephews. No one was seriously suggesting a non-white Bond back then, granted the current political and cultural climate is so far gone now that the early Noughties may as well have been a century ago.

I dare say the Overton window, with regards to everything traditional, has been well and truly smashed.

To me there are no obvious good candidates.
I have seen Dan Stevens suggested. Another one I would put in the category of good actors that I like but who are wrong for the Bond role.
Of the Brits who have been linked with the role either recently or in the not-too-distant past, the only one I like is Matthew Goode.

I hadn't ever considered Goode, as I remember him appearing rather slight in A SINGLE MAN and WATCHMEN. Apparently I was in a minority on his Bondability: https://www.hollywood.com/general/matthew-goode-blows-bond-chances-after-slating-movies-60570498/ (this is from 2016)

While it is easier for me to think of him in some LeCarre project, I say Good on Goode for dissing the Craig efforts. The part about halving the budget and rebooting (again) works for me as well, especially now that Craig seems irrevocably gone at long last.

Always felt Goode would make a great Tanner. Imagine a scene between he and Fassbender/Cavill playing a round of golf before being called to HQ due to an international incident.

Blunt Instrument wrote:

Cavill is 38, a 6-footer, handsome, dark-haired with some very slight greying, has been in a Mission : Impossible flick and the recent big-screen Man From UNCLE and made it to the last 2 the last time Bond was being cast. Incredible to think that all this could actually count AGAINST him getting it this time round, rather than being the prime candidate.  

You know, the thing that will work most for him is the fact he was considered previously. Like Moore, Dalton and Brosnan were (and in Brosnan’s case, hired) several years before eventually taking up the role.

If Martin Campbell is as keen on returning to direct as he’s previously mentioned, I wonder if he’ll return to direct Cavill.

Richard Madden of Bodyguard/GoT fame seems to get touted a lot these days. Few years ago I would've gone 'Meh' but given the Wokeistas drive to bend Bond's identity I think I can support him.

Basically, at this point, my requirements are much like Chief Hurnst's...

CJB wrote:

Richard Madden of Bodyguard/GoT fame seems to get touted a lot these days. Few years ago I would've gone 'Meh' but given the Wokeistas drive to bend Bond's identity I think I can support him.

I’m in this camp, too. Always thought he had a Willem Dafoe thing about him, but I’d rather he than a further disintegration of the Bond character.

CJB wrote:

Richard Madden of Bodyguard/GoT fame seems to get touted a lot these days. Few years ago I would've gone 'Meh' but given the Wokeistas drive to bend Bond's identity I think I can support him.

Basically, at this point, my requirements are much like Chief Hurnst's...

This is my favourite post.

"What do you have to say?
-the bitch!"

I have no clear favorite for the next Bond. Seems entirely different to last time around when there seemed to be so many candidates.

There are several who I’d just like to see their screentests. Dan Stevens is one. Honestly Cavill too (mostly because I am hugely skeptical.) And sure, throw in Madden, too.

I do wonder - in this age of IP bonanza - how willing Eon are to cast Superman as Bond, or Batman (Pattinson) as Bond. Is the exposure given to these faces via franchises just the equivalent of massive television viewership in the 60s/80s (Moore/Brosnan)? Is Madden’s familiarly as Rob Stark so much different than someone playing a superhero in a film that’ll be seen mostly on the small screen over time anyway?

Speaking of which, perhaps a controversial screentest request: Matt Smith.

Quirky looking? Yes, then so is Craig, but I think Smith is more traditional and has grown into his looks since his Doctor Who days. What particularly grabs me about him is his swagger. He had a kind of machismo on Doctor Who that was interesting and which I thought he really brought out as Prince Phillip in The Crown. I saw a clip of him lighting a cig in the trailer for that new Edgar Wright pic and it reminded me of some potential there. Again, far from sold, but for a screentest? Definitely.

Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang wrote:

I’m in this camp, too. Always thought he had a Willem Dafoe thing about him, but I’d rather he than a further disintegration of the Bond character.

Indeed. A 30-something Scotsman might just be what the franchise needs.

Hilly wrote:

This is my favourite post.

"What do you have to say?
-the bitch!"

Heh, thought you'd be a fan!

The bitch? Named after a green vegetable perhaps...

Somerset wrote:

.
I do wonder - in this age of IP bonanza - how willing Eon are to cast Superman as Bond, or Batman (Pattinson) as Bond. Is the exposure given to these faces via franchises just the equivalent of massive television viewership in the 60s/80s (Moore/Brosnan)? Is Madden’s familiarly as Rob Stark so much different than someone playing a superhero in a film that’ll be seen mostly on the small screen over time anyway?

Given every other movie made these days is superhero or comic book type stuff, they'd be hard to pressed to find an actor who hasn't worn a cape or made love to a CGI dragon etc.

CJB wrote:

Given every other movie made these days is superhero or comic book type stuff, they'd be hard to pressed to find an actor who hasn't worn a cape or made love to a CGI dragon etc.

I think you’re right. Someone mentioned casually the other day that even Michael Douglas was a member of the MCU now and my face clouded over like the commander of the Spanish Armada trying to explain to King Philip where all his ships had gone.

CJB wrote:

Given every other movie made these days is superhero or comic book type stuff, they'd be hard to pressed to find an actor who hasn't worn a cape or made love to a CGI dragon etc.

That last bit made me think of MASH and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE ... talk about 'Hot Lips!' "She should have kept her big mouth shut."

Somerset wrote:

Honestly Cavill too (mostly because I am hugely skeptical.)

Thing about Cavil is we haven’t recently seen him act in his natural accent, have we? I certainly haven’t. I think the American accents of UNCLE and MI: Fallout throws him a bit. If he didn’t have to worry about that and focus on embodying Bond (which I imagine wouldn’t be too much of a stretch), he’d do very well. It would be a return to the classic Bond.

Still, holding out for Fassbender, myself. But Cavill would be my next option.

Somerset wrote:

Speaking of which, perhaps a controversial screentest request: Matt Smith.

Quirky looking? Yes, then so is Craig, but I think Smith is more traditional and has grown into his looks since his Doctor Who days. What particularly grabs me about him is his swagger. He had a kind of machismo on Doctor Who that was interesting and which I thought he really brought out as Prince Phillip in The Crown. I saw a clip of him lighting a cig in the trailer for that new Edgar Wright pic and it reminded me of some potential there. Again, far from sold, but for a screentest? Definitely.

Can’t jump on that bandwagon. That quirky look is more fitting for Bond villainy, or at least a great foundation for the makeup artists to really accentuate.

Somerset wrote:

I think you’re right. Someone mentioned casually the other day that even Michael Douglas was a member of the MCU now and my face clouded over like the commander of the Spanish Armada trying to explain to King Philip where all his ships had gone.

Was a little disappointed to learn he had joined that cinema theme park. I guess it augurs well for his currency with a new generation.

Somerset wrote:

I think you’re right. Someone mentioned casually the other day that even Michael Douglas was a member of the MCU now and my face clouded over like the commander of the Spanish Armada trying to explain to King Philip where all his ships had gone.

Heh. I see he was in a movie about a man who may or may not also be an ant.

trevanian wrote:

That last bit made me think of MASH and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE ... talk about 'Hot Lips!' "She should have kept her big mouth shut."

That's the sort of writing GoT was missing once they started writing for the Buzzfeed screencaps pages.

Funny you should say that about Matt Smith, Somerset ... I have pondered what sort of Bond a more 'filled-out' David Tennant would've made.

CJB wrote:

Somerset wrote:

I think you’re right. Someone mentioned casually the other day that even Michael Douglas was a member of the MCU now and my face clouded over like the commander of the Spanish Armada trying to explain to King Philip where all his ships had gone.

Heh. I see he was in a movie about a man who may or may not also be an ant.

Maybe he was pitched that as a modern-day take on Kafka's METAMORPHOSIS.

Deluded actors, even good ones, sometimes drink the damndest Kool-Aid. I remember that Francis Sternhagen actually defended the legitimacy of Hyams' line about OUTLAND being HIGH NOON in space.

Don't jump me here, I have seen OUTLAND an awful lot of times -- and remember the fairly solid laugh the film got opening night when Connery gets an 'eyes only' message on his computer -- and managed to enjoy myself on each and every occasion, largely because of Connery's performance and my fascination with miniature work. But that HIGH NOON analogy can't hold water -- and not just because space is a vacuum.

The Zinneman film isn't set in a domain populated almost entirely by rough-and-tumble miners like The Hyams Bunch on Io, it's in a town of human-sheep hybrids, so the cowardice/survival factor is pretty much bred into them. OUTLAND's workers weren't just families of settler, they were a lot more surly and rough&tumble, as Harlan Ellison pointed out in his dissection of the film (which to use his own analogy when ripping Mark Hamill a new one about STAR WARS, is akin to using a howitzer on a gnat -- or was it that he didn't want to kick cripples?.) He also said Sternhagen's assertion is pretty weak, and how would that stage-trained performer react feel to a hypothetical modernization of RICHARD III ... played out as a Roller Disco movie? (though with the passage of decades, am now wondering if Baz Luhrman might actually try doing that.)

Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang wrote:

CJB wrote:

Richard Madden of Bodyguard/GoT fame seems to get touted a lot these days. Few years ago I would've gone 'Meh' but given the Wokeistas drive to bend Bond's identity I think I can support him.

I’m in this camp, too. Always thought he had a Willem Dafoe thing about him, but I’d rather he than a further disintegration of the Bond character.

I'm not really in favor of Madden but since there are no obviously great candidates I could see it happen.

I do wonder though, in a world where people balk at the idea of a black Bond, will a bi-sexual actor portraying Bond be accepted?

A black actor would be a black Bond. A bisexual actor could portray a straight Bond without problem.

Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang wrote:

It would be a return to the classic Bond.

[...]

Can’t jump on that bandwagon. That quirky look is more fitting for Bond villainy, or at least a great foundation for the makeup artists to really accentuate.

This is the crux, I suppose. No question Cavil is the classic aesthetic. After an overlong tenure with Craig going against that archetypal appearance, how badly do we need it simply for the sake of itself? Is that, in other words, among the top priorities?

There is very good case to be for, yes it should be. (I think acting is overrated anyway.)

In terms of my own preference, I think you have to cast for movement. Connery made that foundational. I recall Hunt saying that’s what got Lazenby the role. I think he put it in terms of sexual confidence. Craig, for his faults, had that (though I do think it feels forced more than some of the other guys...thinking of the scene in CR after he tosses the keys in the bush in the Bahamas). And I think Barbara said it was him walking down the corridor in Elizabeth that made her sit up.

I’m just trying to think of guys that impress me like that, moving on screen. It’s hard.

Blunt Instrument wrote:

Funny you should say that about Matt Smith, Somerset ... I have pondered what sort of Bond a more 'filled-out' David Tennant would've made.

I’m struggling to imagine Tennant filled out! It runs counter to so many of his characters.

I suppose Paul McGann comes closest of the Who guys to descriptionally fitting the role. Might’ve been an interesting candidate at one point.

Yes, it was the fact that Connery was a six-footer but 'moved like a panther' that counted for a lot in his casting.

Somerset wrote:

After an overlong tenure with Craig going against that archetypal appearance, how badly do we need it simply for the sake of itself? Is that, in other words, among the top priorities?

There is very good case to be for, yes it should be. (I think acting is overrated anyway.)

In terms of my own preference, I think you have to cast for movement. Connery made that foundational. I recall Hunt saying that’s what got Lazenby the role. I think he put it in terms of sexual confidence. Craig, for his faults, had that (though I do think it feels forced more than some of the other guys...thinking of the scene in CR after he tosses the keys in the bush in the Bahamas). And I think Barbara said it was him walking down the corridor in Elizabeth that made her sit up.

Good acting is generally good casting, I agree, which is why Lazenby was a very successful Bond in my book. I didn’t know Hunt said that about Lazenby (most accounts, particularly from Lazenby himself, tend to suggest Hunt wasn’t all too enthused with his casting. At least initially, when Harry asked him to fly in from Switzerland to meet George). But I’ve maintained that Lazenby’s physicality matches what Bond’s should be. The sexual confidence is a great way to put it. Like Sean, too. Can’t say I see it with Craig personally. Most part, and perhaps due to the tight tailoring, he seems uncomfortable in his own skin. Look at the gun barrel sequences as an example - all different because of the backlash from fans. Too fast, too hunched over, too slow, too bored, etc. And maybe it’s not his fault because he’s trying to appease fandom... but then that’s not inherently Bond.

Brosnan had it. Whether it’s the gun barrel, walking through Carver’s printing factory, or into the hotel lobby in pyjamas, he inherently carries that confidence.

And I think Cavill does too.

I can't think or picture anyone who has the range or believability. Though he's older now the only one who could and would nail it still to this day is Jason Issacs.

Everyone usually mentioned has none of the necessary elements of the core Bond forerunners which makes them seem so terribly wrong. There has to be some Cary Grant, Errol Flynn, David Niven and many of the others pieces in said new actor to make it work.