Benign Bizarre: Fleming post 1964

Stay with me folks...I was reading YOLT as you good folk know and it got me pondering. Now for one, I used to consider that Fleming's Bond ended with OHMSS and now YOLT, but I pondered something else.

What if is the playground for some folk and alternate history has always fascinated me. What if Fleming didn't die in 1964? He wasn't quite expected to pass so early, various reasons why he ultimately succumbed...but let's say he lived into his 70s or a little further. What would Fleming's Bond become? Would it be affected by the success of the films? Would he like Alistair MacLean essentially just write books to be turned into films? Would ultimately Fleming's Bond lose its way?

I've not read anything that sketches out Fleming's future works but if he was to keep it going post-OHMSS, then surely he would have kept Bond going as long as he could.

At the same time imaging his response to those who followed Connery.

I think Fleming was just about done with writing Bond anyway (of course he even 'killed off' Bond way back when he wrote FRWL).

In saying that, the way the films turned into a phenomenon - particularly after Goldfinger, which Fleming didn't live to see - would perhaps have prompted him to produce at least a few more offerings. No doubt he would've been influenced by the cinematic Bond, as was evidenced by his giving Bond a Scottish heritage. We would've perhaps seen more of that Connery-esque smart alec humour and a gadget or two appear in these hypothetical novels.

If he had lived through the late 60's and 70's, Fleming would've likely been appalled with the further diminishment of Britain's standing in the world and some - but perhaps not all - elements of the so-called cultural revolution. Perhaps that would've translated to his Bond novels, wherein old James would now be looking very much the anachronism, aghast at all the flower power stuff while also observing, disheartedly, America's quagmire in Vietnam.

If he'd lived into his seventies (1978 onwards), Fleming would likely have been a fan of Maggie's and, undoubtedly, would've given Bond some sort of internal monologue around his finding her sexually magnetic. The 80's would've been a boon for the character in many ways, with a resurgence of both British pride and an escalation of the Cold War, though dear old James would be of pension age by that point.

Nice and interesting points, CJB. Interesting to think, isn't it, of Fleming admiring Mrs Thatcher? The Falklands might have gone well with him in that regard. I could see Bond becoming more and more dispirited of the world he lived in. I wouldn't be surprised if in shades of Tom Clancy with Jack Ryan, Bond actually became M.

CJB wrote:

I think Fleming was just about done with writing Bond anyway (of course he even 'killed off' Bond way back when he wrote FRWL).

In saying that, the way the films turned into a phenomenon - particularly after Goldfinger, which Fleming didn't live to see - would perhaps have prompted him to produce at least a few more offerings. No doubt he would've been influenced by the cinematic Bond, as was evidenced by his giving Bond a Scottish heritage. We would've perhaps seen more of that Connery-esque smart alec humour and a gadget or two appear in these hypothetical novels.

If he had lived through the late 60's and 70's, Fleming would've likely been appalled with the further diminishment of Britain's standing in the world and some - but perhaps not all - elements of the so-called cultural revolution. Perhaps that would've translated to his Bond novels, wherein old James would now be looking very much the anachronism, aghast at all the flower power stuff while also observing, disheartedly, America's quagmire in Vietnam.

If he'd lived into his seventies (1978 onwards), Fleming would likely have been a fan of Maggie's and, undoubtedly, would've given Bond some sort of internal monologue around his finding her sexually magnetic. The 80's would've been a boon for the character in many ways, with a resurgence of both British pride and an escalation of the Cold War, though dear old James would be of pension age by that point.

This. Fleming describing Bond's thoughts on Thatcher would have been incredible. Missed opportunity in FYEO, really.

Wonder if Fleming would have kept Bond in the 50s/60s, knowing that the films are keeping the character timeless? His way of keeping the British end up by reminding readers what England used to be.

Hilly wrote:

Nice and interesting points, CJB. Interesting to think, isn't it, of Fleming admiring Mrs Thatcher? The Falklands might have gone well with him in that regard. I could see Bond becoming more and more dispirited of the world he lived in. I wouldn't be surprised if in shades of Tom Clancy with Jack Ryan, Bond actually became M.

Perhaps, before retiring to Jamaica with a bird half his age.

Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang wrote:

Wonder if Fleming would have kept Bond in the 50s/60s, knowing that the films are keeping the character timeless? His way of keeping the British end up by reminding readers what England used to be.

I dunno, can't picture Fleming keeping Bond in a time capsule. His novels were always full of references to contemporaneous phenomena and events. Plus Britain was already stagnating in that post-war period Fleming started writing the books so essentially Bond was always a romantic escape from the dire realities of rationing and national decline.

CJB wrote:

I dunno, can't picture Fleming keeping Bond in a time capsule. His novels were always full of references to contemporaneous phenomena and events. Plus Britain was already stagnating in that post-war period Fleming started writing the books so essentially Bond was always a romantic escape from the dire realities of rationing and national decline.

I say that because Bond is said to be 38 in MR and if we're to say most assignments occur every year (exceptions being the likes of DN occurring only 6 months or so after FRWL) by the time TMWTGG is released, he'd be approaching 45-- or mandatory retirement of field world. Keeping him in the 50s/60s would keep the character alive without being relegated to desk work, or a promotion to a superior position, which would be as exciting as a desk job anyway.

Or, perhaps M changes protocol to allow Bond to continue operating as 007.

And yes, the postwar years showed considerable decline for the British empire, but even more so we rolled into 70s, 80s and beyond. Keeping Bond in his original era would keep that romance alive.

That said, I love Fleming's geopolitical commentary and I'm sure his opinions of contemporary issues would be as fascinating - if not more so - as the years went on.

If mentioned Kennedy favourably (in TWSLM), imagine by the time Nixon/Carter/Reagan rolled about. Had he reached 90 on this planet, Fleming would be driven into the grave by the state of things by then.

The write Nevil Shute left Britain not long after the war as he was largely dismayed at the Labour government and the state of Britain by then (without looking he moved to Australia by at least 1952). Fine, Shute was no Fleming (as much as On the Beach is devastating) but places like Jamaica provided an escape in every sense of the world I'd imagine for Fleming. Though in FYEO you see that even then Jamaica was changing. Interesting to see if Fleming would have taken against the Falkland action derisively (last gasp of an once great country) or he would have rallied behind it...

...there's a parallel world where maybe all of this happened. I always wonder alone what IF would've made of Bond by now if he was looking down on all this.

I think there would have been maybe another book or two and definitely some short stories in addition to some other writings. I definitely think had his health been better we would have had some differences in the late novels and of course TMWTGG would have been different. I also don't know how long he would have stayed hands off love the check with the films as times and social mores shifted though.

The closest you get to later Fleming Bond is in Wood's Spy novelization and passages in early Gardner-particularly Licence Renewed where he tried to reintegrate Fleming in 1980's land.