Albert Finney's character

From slashfilm.com's set visit article:

Quote :

"Kincaide, played by Albert Finney — is fond of old-fashioned English firearms. Think of 19th Century percussion pistols and a very powerful elephant gun that fires .500 Nitro Express cartridges."

http://www.slashfilm.com/skyfall-set-visit-preview-photos/

Bond with the elephant gun:

Maybe Kincaid is the cantankerus caretaker of Skyfall?

Is there a final shootout at Skyfall? If so, I'm thinking of L.A. CONFIDENTIAL.

Well if Kincade is superior over M, i'm sure he is a villain and perhaps superior over Silva.

Scene 165 is a scene with Kincade, M, Bond and Silva. And Silva looks excited when he sees them, suspicious?

Kincade won't be Silva's superior officer. It's already been established that Silva is the primary villain.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

Kincade won't be Silva's superior officer. It's already been established that Silva is the primary villain.

But Hi Fat was Scaramanga's superior ( at least he thought he was) until Francisco blew him away. Silva is the lead villain sure, but we really have no idea who these characters are or how they relate to each other in both their histories and present context, although we can make lots of good guesses I guess.

And my guess is that while Kincade might be a villain, he won't be aligned with Silva.

It's been noted that there are similarities between SKYFALL and the original GOLDENEYE draft. One of the features of that draft was the way the character who would go on to become Alec Trevelyan was originally a former M. Although Judi Dench is 77, I've always seen her M as being in her late 50s or early 60s. So I think Kincade could be her predecessor, and that the horrible secret from her past comes from a time when he was in control of the agency and Dench was a rising star tipped as his successor.

Yeah, there's also the helicopter chase with the Aston Martin which was in the original Michael France draft IIRC.

If you're referring to that video that showed the Aston being followed by a helicopter, I'm not sure that's a chase sequence. There are no obvious cameras in the video taken at the side of the road, which leads me to believe that the helicopter is filming the car, rather than chasing it. I imagine it would sort of follow the car for a while and then sort of pan up to give us our first look at Skyfall Lodge.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

. So I think Kincade could be her predecessor, and that the horrible secret from her past comes from a time when he was in control of the agency and Dench was a rising star tipped as his successor.

Yes I think this makes sense, and is actually quite likely.

We should have this entire film fully scoped by the time its released. I really do think that enhances the viewing experience; knowing the story and then seeing how it plays out on screen.

My money is still on Finney playing the caretaker of SKYFALL. His fascination will old weaponry suggests that's what he's up to. Doubt he's the "old M" or such (as if the old M would hang out in a decrepit estate in Scotland).

Harmsway wrote:

(as if the old M would hang out in a decrepit estate in Scotland).

My theory calls for this to be a safe house.

Why would Bond's old decrepit family estate be a safe house? And why would such a safe house be stocked with old weaponry like an elephant gun? Just 'cause Kincade likes it?

Theories should evolve from the evidence, not be imposed on it. It makes more sense, given what we know, that Kincade is Bond's caretaker, not that he's an old M.

Harmsway wrote:

Why would Bond's old decrepit family estate be a safe house? And why would such a safe house be stocked with old weaponry like an elephant gun? Just 'cause Kincade likes it?

My theory is that the lodge was owned by Bond's parents. When they died and James went to live with his aunt, the ownership of the house was open-ended. Kincade, knowing Bond's parents (Andrew Bond was always written as loyal to the throne, wasn't he?), saw this as a prime opportunity to discreetly pick up Skyall Lodge as a safe house.

That makes more sense to me than Kincade being some ancient caretaker with a liking of old guns.

Your theory doesn't make sense on a few levels. For one, it doesn't explain the love of 1800s weaponry. Surely a safe house would be better stocked than with such nonsense as an elephant gun. And If Bond/M are on the run, why would they go to an MI6 safe house by their lonesome, with only an ancient guy to assist them? If they're running from MI6, surely they would select a non-MI6 locale, not a known safe house. And if they're working with MI6, surely they can do better for support than just 007 and M.

Furthermore, one of the users at CB.n noted that the photos of Skyfall Lodge showed a tombstone for the previous ghillie of the estate. That they took the time to add that detail suggests that Kincaid is in fact the current ghillie, which would also go hand-in-hand with his affection for old firearms like the elephant gun.

Kincaid being an old caretaker with an affection for outdated weaponry makes infinitely more sense than some convoluted, unsubstantiated theory about him being an old M (which seems to be based on little else than your personal affection for the idea). Kincaid as caretaker is a simple explanation, and the simpler the explanation, the better.

Harmsway wrote:

For one, it doesn't explain the love of 1800s weaponry. Surely a safe house would be better stocked than with such nonsense as an elephant gun.

It's Kincade's personal taste rather than a stock at the safehouse.

Harmsway wrote:

And If Bond/M are on the run, why would they go to an MI6 safe house by their lonesome, with only an ancient guy to assist them? If they're running from MI6, surely they would select a non-MI6 locale, not a known safe house. And if they're working with MI6, surely they can do better for support than just 007 and M.

The early rumours - no doubt fuelled by Patricia Malcolm, who owns the castle at Duntrune - suggested that Bond "would be taking all the villains back to his childhood home". My theory that Kincade is a former M and that Skyfall Lodge is an old MI6 safe house is part of a much larger threoy that holds that "Skyfall" also refers to an off-the-books operation that was conceived at the house. Bond lures the likes of Silva to the lodge on the premise that the lodge is where everything was set in motion.

Harmsway wrote:

Furthermore, one of the users at CB.n noted that the photos of Skyfall Lodge showed a tombstone for the previous ghillie of the estate. That they took the time to add that detail suggests that Kincaid is in fact the current ghillie, which would also go hand-in-hand with his affection for old firearms like the elephant gun.

If Kincade were living at Skyall Lodge in his retirement, then he'd naturally look after the place.

Harmsway wrote:

Kincaid being an old caretaker with an affection for outdated weaponry makes infinitely more sense than some convoluted, unsubstantiated theory about him being an old M (which seems to be based on little else than your personal affection for the idea).

This isn't a theory that I've concocted and then tried to explain everything else around it in a way that makes it all fit nicely. It's actually a recent theory, born out of a much larger theory that I've been working on (and posting about) since November.

Harmsway wrote:

Kincaid as caretaker is a simple explanation, and the simpler the explanation, the better.

Kincade as a caretaker makes no sense to me. It just feels like a five-minute cameo, and if Bond is indeed bringing all the villains to one place for the final confrontation, then there is no way he would put the life of someone who is innocent in jeopardy.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

My theory that Kincade is a former M and that Skyfall Lodge is an old MI6 safe house is part of a much larger threoy that holds that "Skyfall" also refers to an off-the-books operation that was conceived at the house. Bond lures the likes of Silva to the lodge on the premise that the lodge is where everything was set in motion.

A theory that is little more than fanfiction.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

If Kincade were living at Skyall Lodge in his retirement, then he'd naturally look after the place.

If he's a retired M, he's likely to have retired in style, not live at a decrepit manor house that looks near-abandoned, and dress in clothing like a caretaker would wear.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

Kincade as a caretaker makes no sense to me.

So you say, but it seems more to do with you not liking the idea than it does with it being unlikely.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

It just feels like a five-minute cameo, and if Bond is indeed bringing all the villains to one place for the final confrontation, then there is no way he would put the life of someone who is innocent in jeopardy.

Sure he would. Bond isn't so concerned with collateral damage. If the caretaker is willing to take on the bastards to protect the Skyfall homestead, Bond isn't going to turn him down. And I don't see any reason why Kincaid wouldn't be a minor role. Finney seems largely to do minor appearances these days (cameos in OCEAN'S TWELVE and THE BOURNE ULTIMATUM).

And if he's the caretaker, it's likely that Kincaid has some important dramatic monologue about knowing Bond's parents, and how much they meant to him, etc. and so forth. Not just throwaway cameo stuff.

Harmsway wrote:

A taste for inaccurate weapons? Come on, now.

A man can't collect 19th-century weapons as a hobby?

Harmsway wrote:

A theory that is similarly unsubstantiated. Theory should be derived from evidence, not from supposition.

And yet, the rumours fuelled by Malcolm have proven to be remarkably accurate so far ...

Harmsway wrote:

If he's a retired M, he's likely to have retired in style, not live at a decrepit manor house that looks near-abandoned.

That's a massive assumption. Why can't a man aspire to retiring in a manor house in a little pocket of the world that no-one ever visits? After a lifetime of managing and acting on behalf of an intelligence agency, it sounds quite tranquil to me.

Harmsway wrote:

So you say, but you never explain why.

I did explain why - in my very next point.

Harmsway wrote:

Sure he would. Bond isn't so concerned with collateral damage.

I think he is - that's what the whole "half monk, half hitman" line in CASINO ROYALE is all about. He's not a thug. he's not a gangster. He doesn't kill indiscriminately (yes, he kills several people in QUANTUM OF SOLACE, but he is almost always attacked first and/or put in a position where he has no choice). He's certainly not going to jeopardise the lives of others if he can help it.

Harmsway wrote:

And I don't see any reason why Kincaid wouldn't be a minor role. Finney seems largely to do minor appearances these days (cameos in OCEAN'S TWELVE and THE BOURNE ULTIMATUM).

His role in ULTIMATUM (and no doubt LEGACY) was small, but it was also important to the plot. A role as a former M would be similarly-suffiicent.

Harmsway wrote:

And if he's the caretaker, it's likely that Kincaid has some important dramatic monologue about knowing Bond's parents, and how much they meant to him, etc. and so forth. Not just throwaway cameo stuff.

That sounds exactly like a cameo. If he can be trimmed out without affecting the events of the story, it's a cameo.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

And yet, the rumours fuelled by Malcolm have proven to be remarkably accurate so far ...

Your theory, as far as I'm aware, isn't directly related to anything from Malcolm.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

Why can't a man aspire to retiring in a manor house in a little pocket of the world that no-one ever visits?

A *decrepit* manor house?

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

His role in ULTIMATUM (and no doubt LEGACY) was small, but it was also important to the plot.

So would a role as the one person who knew Bond's parents when they were alive. ;)

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

That sounds exactly like a cameo. If he can be trimmed out without affecting the events of the story, it's a cameo.

And what if such a scene proved pivotal to Bond's emotional journey? (As it no doubt would.)

Anyway, I should stop. I should know better than to have entered into this argument.



Time for bed.

Harmsway wrote:

Your theory, as far as I'm aware, isn't directly related to anything from Malcolm.

My theory is born from the idea that Bond would bring all the villains together at his childhood home. My question is simple: why would he do that? My answer is that the home is the one thing everyone involved in "Skyfall" has in common. It is the place where "Skyfall" began, so Bond knows that it is the one thing that will pique the interests of all involved.

Harmsway wrote:

A *decrepit* manor house?

So he's not very good at looking after the house. Or his health is failing. Call it a quirk of personality.

Harmsway wrote:

So would a role as the one person who knew Bond's parents when they were alive. ;)

Somehow, I don't think the Bonds only knew one person when they were alive.

Harmsway wrote:

And what if such a scene proved pivotal to Bond's emotional journey? (As it no doubt would.)

Then the film would probably be horrendous, because the only way I can see that fitting into the story is if M was responsible for the deaths of Bond's parents.

Harmsway wrote:

Time for bed.

You do that. Me, I'm going to stay awake. Mostly because it's only 1pm here.

One last post. Spoken like a true internet addict.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

Somehow, I don't think the Bonds only knew one person when they were alive.

What I meant to say is that he may have been the last living person who knew the Bonds intimately.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

Then the film would probably be horrendous, because the only way I can see that fitting into the story is if M was responsible for the deaths of Bond's parents.

If you suppose that M feels guilty for the death of Bond's parents, pretty much everything we know about SKYFALL comes together. Love it or hate it, I'm fairly certain that Operation Skyfall left Bond orphaned (and also damaged Silva in some way), and that's why the psych exam mentions the operation; there are concerns that Bond may have participated in the attack on MI6 in retaliation.

Harmsway wrote:

Love it or hate it, I'm fairly certain that Operation Skyfall left Bond orphaned (and also damaged Silva in some way), and that's why the psych exam mentions the operation; there are concerns that Bond may have participated in the attack on MI6 in retaliation.

Personally, I think "Operation Skyfall" might have been a plan to spring Patrice from MI6 custody - as seen in the pre-titles - in he hopes that he would lead MI6 to Silva, with Bond staging his own death to convince Patrice that he is in the clear. Six months later, MI6 have no new leads and have set a dangerous mercenary loose on the world. Silva expresses his thanks for this with an explosion, and Bond is recalled to active duty. The psych evaluation is to see how responseble and/or guilty Bond feels for carrying out the operation that indirectly led to the attack on MI6.

How true. We've all been there.

When you guys figure out who Kincaid is ( I defer of course, as I haven't a clue) could you once and for all, also determine whether Harris is the new MP. This is the most pressing question concering SF I believe. The uncertainty is causing me much stress. I just want to know. I don't even care whether she is or isn't any more. I just want to know.

This theory is intriguing and quite plausible. Hmmm. This could be a very smart little story we have here.

Harmsway wrote:

If you suppose that M feels guilty for the death of Bond's parents, pretty much everything we know about SKYFALL comes together. Love it or hate it, I'm fairly certain that Operation Skyfall left Bond orphaned (and also damaged Silva in some way), and that's why the psych exam mentions the operation; there are concerns that Bond may have participated in the attack on MI6 in retaliation.

tiffanywint wrote:

determine whether Harris is the new MP. This is the most pressing question concering SF I believe. The uncertainty is causing me much stress. I just want to know. I don't even care whether she is or isn't any more. I just want to know.

Harris has said she is not. That shou;d be enough fo an answer for you.

tiffanywint wrote:

This theory is intriguing and quite plausible. Hmmm. This could be a very smart little story we have here.

Harmsway wrote:

If you suppose that M feels guilty for the death of Bond's parents, pretty much everything we know about SKYFALL comes together. Love it or hate it, I'm fairly certain that Operation Skyfall left Bond orphaned (and also damaged Silva in some way), and that's why the psych exam mentions the operation; there are concerns that Bond may have participated in the attack on MI6 in retaliation.

"Smart little story"?

Sorry, but since we know M's past is tied directly into the story of SKYFALL, then the idea that "Operation Skyfall" resulted in the deaths of Bond's parents means that M is (however indirectly) responsible for their deaths.

That's not going to give us a "smart little story".

That's going to give us wagnst.

Prisoner Monkeys wrote:

"Smart little story"?

Sorry, but since we know M's past is tied directly into the story of SKYFALL, then the idea that "Operation Skyfall" resulted in the deaths of Bond's parents means that M is (however indirectly) responsible for their deaths.

That's not going to give us a "smart little story".

That's going to give us wagnst.

Whatever. Change smart to good. And take out the "little" then. But the theory is quite plausible.

Then if Harris is not MP.....who the heck is? Surely if an actress has been cast, even for a quick walk-on/reveal near film's end, it would have been leaked by now, wouldn't it?

Also Harris has been rather cagey about her denials. She's left wiggle room. IMO she is still in the running.

tiffanywint wrote:

Then if Harris is not MP.....who the heck is? Surely if an actress has been cast, even for a quick walk-on/reveal near film's end, it would have been leaked by now, wouldn't it?

It's entirely possible that there is no Moneypenny in the film. Her presence was never promised.