Last Movie You Watched? 7.0

I do give credit to T4 for breaking away from the formula, however misguided the execution was. Please, anyone but McG.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN253RLDdM8

I can't believe the only idea anyone had for T2 was "the same thing, only now Arnie's the good guy"

I think this is the only place in the world where T2 has such a bad reputation.

I've heard people say, as their justification for why T2 is the best movie in the franchise, that the T-1000 is an iconically cool bad guy. Which is true, but that's sorta like saying THE PHANTOM MENACE is the best Star Wars because of how cool Darth Maul is.

I don't understand how someone can hold the T-1000 to such a high standard when the original film had an unstoppable robot vs a human. You expect Arnold and the T-1000 to duke it out until the end of time, but Reese is mortal. It took a car running over him, two explosions, and a hydraulic press to kill the T-800, yet Reese gets a limp from jumping in a dumpster and is killed by shrapnel. You wonder when Arnold bests the T-1000, yet you wonder IF and HOW the T-800 will meet it's demise in the original.

I still like T2, if not as much as the original. T1 is a chase movie executed to perfection, T2 is a popcorn flick with enough substance to give it a certain depth. Cameron needs to stop writing his movies, though, or at the very least have someone else write the dialog for him.

What bugs me is that T2 ends with you wanting to see a badass, on the run, Che Guevera like Sarah Connor training her son to be an indomitable future warrior -- and instead what we get is Sarah in a mental hospital, Connor a whiny 90s kid, the T-800 now spouting catchphrases and thumbs up, a villain who disappears for hours at a time, and a new narrative that abandons the perfect time loop of the first movie in exchange for a plot in which our heroes feel justified in killing tons of people and causing tons of property damage because it MAY make the future a better place, despite the fact that if the future is changed NOTHING that's happened in any of the movies makes any sense at all -- "there is no fate but what you make" is a nice sentiment, but it creates a plot mess and T3 had to work real hard to undo that bullshit. That's why I double hate the Extended Edition of T2 that ends with John becoming President of some Utopian future.

Sorry, but the fucked up kid with daddy issues who's main skills are guerilla warfare and computer programming and who caused the death of a ton of cops and innocent citizens isn't gonna become the president. The skills of being a war leader are not the skills of being a baby kisser.

Most of Cameron's post-ALIENS movies (and his extended cut of ALIENS) suffer from this same kind of inane, saccharine, sentimentality, couple with asininely simplistic plots. Which is fine, except then why are all his movies longer than a Russian epic? I can't stand the extra scenes in ALIENS, which kill all the tension and subtlety in favour of beating us over the head with "NUCLEAR FAMILIES ARE GREAT, AMIRITE?"

T1 is a pulpy, indie, gritty, movie that treats the idea of an unstoppable killer robot in an acceptably realistic manner.
T2 is to T1 as the 1987 Ninja Turtles cartoon is to the 1984 indie comics -- maybe not that extreme a difference, but same idea.

T3 at least, on some levels, makes sense, and while it has some dumb shit in it, ending the movie with the world going Kaboom is just awesome. That's balls. T3 should've been called "JUDGEMENT DAY" except that'd give the ending away.

The main problem with T2 and T3 is that the over-reliance on the "send a robot back in time to kill a dude" formula really kills the drama of the "It's just HIM and ME!" set up of the first film, as well as weakening the suspension of disbelief for the series as a whole. The time machine is specifically said as destroyed after Reese goes through in the first film (although you have the nice loophole that Reese wouldn't know for sure what happened after he left), and the T-800 is specifically stated in dialogue to be the most advanced robot Skynet has at the time of its DEFEAT in 2029. So having more and more advanced robots continue to go through in the sequels makes no sense -- and of course you wonder why they don't just send them back to 1984 again to kill Sarah Connor again rather than sending them to increasingly advanced stages in John's life.

Really the only story I want after T1 is the hero's journey of John Connor. Y'know, a two-and-a-half hour movie where we basically get his mom teaching him to be a badass as a kid, kicking the bucket, he grows up off the grid and witnesses the end of the world, he becomes a soldier, marries the redhead, frees the camps, leads the revolution, wins the war, sends Kyle back, etc. Basically all the best parts of the sequels, minus the time travel/Worthington stuff, and plus an ending. Model it on the structure of DUNE -- works for all the other sci-fi epics.

Quote :

T3 at least, on some levels, makes sense, and while it has some dumb shit in it, ending the movie with the world going Kaboom is just awesome

Done before and better in BENEATH THE PLANET OF THE APES. In 1970 it was ballsy. By 2003.... not really.

True. And I much prefer BENEATH THE PLANET OF THE APES. When I say ballsy I mean ballsy in comparison to T2's whimpy "everything is okay so long as you believe in the power of love!" ethos, and ballsy for a Hollywood franchise blockbuster not even being helmed by said franchise's creator. Ballsy for T3, an otherwise witless movie, not ballsy in general.

Tubes wrote:

I don't understand how someone can hold the T-1000 to such a high standard when the original film had an unstoppable robot vs a human. You expect Arnold and the T-1000 to duke it out until the end of time, but Reese is mortal. It took a car running over him, two explosions, and a hydraulic press to kill the T-800, yet Reese gets a limp from jumping in a dumpster and is killed by shrapnel. You wonder when Arnold bests the T-1000, yet you wonder IF and HOW the T-800 will meet it's demise in the original.

I still like T2, if not as much as the original. T1 is a chase movie executed to perfection, T2 is a popcorn flick with enough substance to give it a certain depth. Cameron needs to stop writing his movies, though, or at the very least have someone else write the dialog for him.

correction, Reese is killed by falling into the vat of molten metal before he can self repair

it's a sequel and Arnold is the star, so yes you know in the back of your mind he's going to win, that comes with the terretory and is true of most action movies, Diehard, Lethal Weapon, etc
this isn't true of the first one because at the time everyone involved except Arnold was relatively unknown and even Arnold is just a novelty body builder still trying to establish himself as a viable star, so any ending was possible

but I agree that T1 is better, it was both original and perfectly realised, but T2 is pretty awesome for a sequel, even T3 was of a decent standard, T4? it's so different in look and feel, it doesn't work as a sequel for me, they were just cashing in on the name

Tubes wrote:

I still like T2, if not as much as the original. T1 is a chase movie executed to perfection, T2 is a popcorn flick with enough substance to give it a certain depth.

That's a really good delineation between the two, and it lets me off the hook for enjoying the second one every now and then. The BluRay is only five bucks on amazon right now, and I'm sorely tempted, since I need to spend three bucks to get up to the free shipping level ...

Seve wrote:

T4? it's so different in look and feel, it doesn't work as a sequel for me, they were just cashing in on the name

You could say the same of ALIENS, yet that's why everyone praises its brilliance -- because it was different and took the franchise to the next logical step rather than rehashing the original. That's what I liked about T4 -- that it wasn't just another "Skynet sends robot back to kill Connor, Connor sends robot back to defend himself -- surprise surprise Connor lives" story. That's also why Sarah Connor Chronicles was boring as fuck. It's essentially T2: The Television Series -- any TV series with a built-in, pre-supposed ending is worthless, See: Smallville, where they jumped through a million hoops keeping Clark from becoming Superman for ten years.

trevanian wrote:

Tubes wrote:

I still like T2, if not as much as the original. T1 is a chase movie executed to perfection, T2 is a popcorn flick with enough substance to give it a certain depth.

That's a really good delineation between the two, and it lets me off the hook for enjoying the second one every now and then. The BluRay is only five bucks on amazon right now, and I'm sorely tempted, since I need to spend three bucks to get up to the free shipping level ...

Watch out which version you get. Apparently one of them sucks cyborg balls.

Actually, the 5 buck one seems legit: http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Terminator-2-Judgment-Day-Blu-ray/4024/#Review

T2 Skynet Edition (Lionsgate) Blu-ray:

T2 Premium Edition (Geneon) Blu-ray:

T2 (Lionsgate) Blu-ray:

T2 Extreme Edition (Artisan) DVD:

Maybe mine eyes deceive me, but the three Blu-Ray releases look much the same.

I still have that Ultimate Edition DVD, don't really care enough for an upgrade.

The Skynet Edition includes both cuts and lossless audio. Barring some serious image defects (PREDATOR's DNR), it's probably the version to get.

It's a lot easier than the DVD choices. The Extreme Edition has the better visuals, yet the Ultimate Edition has more audio choices and extras.

The Next Three Days - serviceable-if-implausible thriller in which Russell Crowe plots to break his wrongly-convicted-of-murder wife (Elizabeth Banks) out of prison and flee the States with their young son. Written and directed by the Haggfish, which I'm sure will recommend it to many here .

Home Movies (1980)

The comedy just doesn't work. Some things interested me, but it's was a bit of a haul to sit though.

Cat People (1942)

A solid little flick.

Night Passage (1957)

It was supposed to be another Western film starring James Stewart and directed by Anthony Mann, but Mann backed out. Pity. The story is just as good as any of the other Mann Westerns, but this film would have been better with his direction.

I approve of that avatar.

I tried to make a Babs-with-scumbag-hat avatar, but I don't have the software to do it.

A nice ending to SKYFALL could be that Bond himself is to revealed to be Moneypenny.

Largo's Shark wrote:

I approve of that avatar.

tends to freak out, definitely not my happening

The White Tuxedo wrote:

I tried to make a Babs-with-scumbag-hat avatar, but I don't have the software to do it.

A nice ending to SKYFALL could be that Bond himself is to revealed to be Moneypenny.

Explains gunbarrel placement re: still becoming Bond. Instead he is still 'becoming' ... but in the a Fiennes way a la RED DRAGON, transforming and w/ the sex change thrown in for bad measure.

Could call the next movie ALTERED STATES. Bond re-becoming (again.)

DO YOU SEE?

NO.

The fun Jame would have had with M.

House of Usher (1960)

Jolly good fun.