Hollywoodies.

Erica Ambler wrote:

Salomé wrote:

It takes an Evel Knievel worthy leap of logic to go from "perhaps serial sexual predators should be held accountable for their actions?" to "fuck all men!".

Laws already exists to punish criminal behaviour, though I agree with you that all men should be fucked - that's all most of us want, really. Melanie Phillips' point is:

Quote :

Sexual attacks or harassment are being conflated with minor incidents of lewd and crass behaviour. A man placing his hand on a woman’s knee is being denounced in the same breath as rape.

Is it though? I don't think anyone is seriously equating the two things with each other.

http://variety.com/2017/biz/news/jon-bernthal-kevin-spacey-1202610696/

Interesting, though not very relevant in terms of the accusations.
A lot of actors and directors have a reputation of being dicks on (and off) set.

I did notice that David O'Russell has also been dragged into this somewhat, with a reexamination of his crazy on-set behavior in the past (his near-fight with Clooney on "Three Kings", his explosion of rage against Lily Tomlin during the shoot of "I Heart Huckabees" and more recently his abusive behavior towards Amy Adams on the set of "American Hustle").
As a side-note, I do find his work ridiculously overrated.

I find his work overrated also. 

What happened with Amy Adams? I've heard about the confrontations with Clooney and Tomlin, but not Amy Adams. How could you get angry at her? She seems like one of the most humble, level headed people in Hollywood. 

Two women have come forward saying a Gossip Girl actor raped them. Don't know the accused nor the accusers but obviously it's deplorable behaviour if true.

FieldsMan wrote:

I find his work overrated also. 

What happened with Amy Adams? I've heard about the confrontations with Clooney and Tomlin, but not Amy Adams. How could you get angry at her? She seems like one of the most humble, level headed people in Hollywood. 

Two women have come forward saying a Gossip Girl actor raped them. Don't know the accused nor the accusers but obviously it's deplorable behaviour if true.

Supposedly O'Russell was very abusive throughout the shoot to Amy Adams, so much so that an exasperated Christian Bale eventually stepped in and told O'Russell to stop acting like an asshole to her.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

Salomé wrote:

Christian Bale eventually stepped in and told O'Russell to stop acting like an asshole to her.

In 15 years time,  Adams will file criminal charges against Bale accusing him of being patronising and mansplaining. That's the normal practice.

I think you are overreacting a bit. There is nothing wrong with serial abusers being outed for what they are.

And in terms of the Hollywood revelations, very few of them have been of the mild variety so far.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

A joke is overreacting? File charges.

It wasn't really in response to the joke but to the tenor of some of your recent posts, which seem to consider this current backlash at least partially out of proportion.
I think with the large majority of stories coming out of the entertainment industry, the accusations are serious enough to warrant the attention that has been devoted to them.

For the most part, these women aren't accusing men of a mere "hand on the knee" scenario.

Every single woman has instances of unwanted/unwelcome touching in her past.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

Salomé wrote:

Every single woman has instances of unwanted/unwelcome touching in her past.

We all have. Part of life.

Well yes, but the majority of the Hollywood accusations are about behavior that goes well beyond that.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

A joke is overreacting? File charges.

Salomé wrote:

There is nothing wrong with serial abusers being outed for what they are.

And in terms of the Hollywood revelations, very few of them have been of the mild variety so far.

You don't believe in innocent until proven guilty do you? Another irritating anglo-saxon concept.

I do. As far as I know, none of these men have been imprisoned?
In any case, with many of these cases, the statute of limitations will have been exceeded.
So I expect all of them to get out of this fairly unscathed, including Weinstein.
He'll just have to be patient and go through the 'redemption and rehabilitation' performance theater.

In the case of Weinstein, the bulk of his supposed crimes took place in NYC and California.

That means that in the case of California, he is off the hook for any accusations older than ten years and in NYC, he is in the clear for anything but first degree rape (which I believe does not conform to any of the stories as they have been presented thus far) for any accusation involving an incident older than five years.

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It is interesting that the only accused who is really feeling the bulk of the backlash is Kevin Spacey.
Production on his show has been halted. Ridley Scott is going to re-shoot his role in his upcoming film.

Erica Ambler wrote:

The law is very specific about what constitutes assault. Agreeing to sex to further your career and then regretting it is a mistake not assault.

And this is what you reduce all of the accusations to? Interesting.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

All of the Spacey allegations seem to be straight forward assault rather than "I'll give you a part in my movie if you sleep with me". Big difference.

Yeah, but shouldn't "innocent until proven guilty" also apply to him?

Salomé wrote:

Erica Ambler wrote:

All of the Spacey allegations seem to be straight forward assault rather than "I'll give you a part in my movie if you sleep with me". Big difference.

Yeah, but shouldn't "innocent until proven guilty" also apply to him?

It should apply to all of us. Justice is the least we can expect.

Erica Ambler wrote:

Salomé wrote:

Erica Ambler wrote:

All of the Spacey allegations seem to be straight forward assault rather than "I'll give you a part in my movie if you sleep with me". Big difference.

Yeah, but shouldn't "innocent until proven guilty" also apply to him?

It should apply to all of us. Justice is the least we can expect.

However, it seems no one has alleged that Spacey attempted to trade sex for favours, which is the case in most of the other stories.

Is it though? It seems primarily a theme in Ashley Judd's story.

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Erica Ambler wrote:

Can you point me to a good summary? Must be one out there somewhere.

I know Asia Argento says she was raped, which makes me wonder why criminal charges have not been brought.

Asia Argento is one of the more complex accusers. She admits that she also at one point had a consensual sexual relationship with Weinstein.
I believe this is one of the reasons why she has faced such a backlash in her home country.

This is an incomplete list (it's a month old), but it's the most succinct listing I could find on short notice:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/10/us/harvey-weinstein-accusations.html

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