Previous Debate: Naomie Harris as Moneypenny - Approve or not?

Naomie Harris as Moneypenny - Would you approve of the choice or not?

BTW, if anybody ticks "no", it doesn't automatically make that person a "racist", so please let's not go there with this.


(M or Mods, can this be marked as this week's debate, with last week's debate title amended accordingly? Cheers).

I voted no. I'm not a racist.

Basically, I don't think she is much of an actress, so I don't know if she can pull off one of the most loved characters of the franchise. I was never really supporting the notion ofher being a Bond girl as initially suggested. So it isn't a matter of racial discrimination and all of that jazz. When she was rumoured to be playing Moneypenny, I was vexated because Moneypenny is traditionally a white character, and that's how I want it to be. I like retro Bond, so reform isn't what I'm after.

She was very good in the BBC drama, Small Island. Other than that I've only seen her in the Pirates films which I've tried to block from my mind. Is she any worse an actress than Caroline Bliss or Samantha Bond? Don't think so. Don't see how we can judge her until we've actually seen her as Moneypenny. I know a few of us felt she wasn't particularly attractive enough to be a Bond girl but the part of Moneypenny is a whole new ball game. Of course it isn't racist to say no, but would there be such mixed sentiments about her casting (from what I've gathered from other threads anyway) if she was white? Again, I don't think so.

No because, as I've stated in another thread, the casting of Harris suggests that Babs' galloping politicization of the Bond series, inaugurated in earnest in QOS, will proceed apace in B23.

If she was white, I still don't think she'd be that good of a Moneypenny. Bliss was a bit give-or-take, but I really liked Bond in the role. I think Bond is a great actress to be honest. Besides, I don't like Harris' attitude towards the Bond series.

I approve. Although I'd rather she play a character central to the plot (and someone Bond would bang), I think she'll make a good Moneypenny. Despite her exotic looks, Harris seems to have the right reserve and charm for the role. She surely won't sound like a Jamaican voodoo priestess - in real-life she's got a lovely English accent.

Tux, what attitude do you mean? I you're referring to what she said about Bond girls nowadays being "different" and all - that's a safe answer that pretty much any actress will say. She's also said that she and her family have always liked the films - I think she's earnest there.

Personally, I couldn't care less if they didn't bring Moneypenny back at all, let alone what colour her skin is. As to Harris, I guess you could say I'm ambivalent.

FieldsMan wrote:

I voted no. I'm not a racist.

I voted yes. I'm a racist.

All I care is that they write a damn good scene for Moneypenny. Give her a reason to come back.

I vote nay.

From what I've seen of her, she's an alright actress. Neither bad nor remarkable.

Nevertheless, I'll freely say that I think Miss Moneypenny should be played by a white actress as the character has always been white. If a recurring black character in a film series was replaced by a white actor, there'd be howls of outrage and the dreaded R-word would be bandied about incessantly.

CJB wrote:

I vote nay.

From what I've seen of her, she's an alright actress. Neither bad nor remarkable.

Nevertheless, I'll freely say that I think Miss Moneypenny should be played by a white actress as the character has always been white. If a recurring black character in a film series was replaced by a white actor, there'd be howls of outrage and the dreaded R-word would be bandied about incessantly.

^ What he said.

Of course, I will still see the movie if she's cast and possibly revise my opinion if she impresses.

I've only watched her in 28 DAYS LATER, so I really can't judge her acting abilities.

I guess I'll just have to wait and see.

Can't recall seeing her in anything, even though I've seen 28 Days Later but just don't recall her performance. I've no doubt she must have some ability or else she wouldn't be mooted for the part, but it's the reasoning behind the decision which worries me; Babs strikes again. I haven't a racist bone in my body, but casting Harris as Moneypenny could have Bond walking on eggshells in scenes which are usually casual and flirtatious. The slightest whiff of Bond being overly flirtatious could be construed as the white man viewing the black woman as an "inferior race sex object", etc, which leads me to believe that things between Bond and Moneypenny will be even frostier and female upper-handed than when Samantha Bond debuted with her blatantly in-your-face PC diatribe about her not needing Bond and "sexual harrassment" comments.

All of this agenda s*** Babs seems to be constantly pushing just feels completely unnecessary and self-satisfying. At the end of the day, Moneypenny is a character who shares nothing more than just a couple of minutes of fun byplay with 007, and that's all it needs to be. Had Cubby cast a non-white Moneypenny thirty years ago, then sure there may have been comments made about it but at least it would have felt as if the decision had no agenda attached to it. I'd have been perfectly happy had that happened BTW, no complaints. But, on the back of the exaggeratedly detrimental prominence of Dench's M, the "pussification" of Brosnan's Bond at the hands of females in GoldenEye, the occasional political pretensions of Quantum Of Solace, ridiculously pretensious notions of Bond as some kind of potential BAFTA-worthy drama which should be helmed by or written by out-of-genre "Oscar luvvies" and then an ad with Bond being dressed as a woman and spoken down to by the all-conquering female Dench, I can't help but wonder whether this potential casting of Harris is being made more as a self-serving statement by Babs rather than it being a simple case of finding the right woman for the job. At the very least, this appointment puts unwarranted and potentially unwelcome scrutiny on what should really just be a couple of minutes of friendly office banter. But no, some kind of statement seems to have to be made.

I've nothing against Harris, nor would I have batted an eyelid had a non-white Moneypenny been appointed back in Cubby's day when every other move didn't seem to have an underlying or selfish political or personal agenda, and I've no problem whatsoever with the casting of a non-white Moneypenny solely in general terms as an isolated agenda-free casting decision; In fact, I welcomed the casting of both Bernie Casey and Jeffrey Wright as two non-white Felix Leiters and thought both were very good in the role. So this is not about "race" in the slightest. It's about Babs. And I don't trust her as far as I could throw her. She comes across to me as somebody who resents the core characteristics of the Bond franchise, thus constantly tries to fit a square into a round hole by trying to incorporate soap opera-level wannabe BAFTA dramatics into what is always otherwise a dumbass explosions, gadgets and tits flick.

So, nothing against Harris personally, but what I sense to be the thinking or self-serving agenda behind this casting makes it a "no" from me. Harris may well turn out to be fine as Moneypenny in a singular acting sense, but I simply fear that this casting decision's ultimate ramifications will have something to do with whatever eventual plan Babs is working towards to eventually overthrow and self-puppetise the beloved central character she seems to resent so much.

I don't disapprove, so I voted yes.

Damn, Lazzers, that post was superb.

G Section wrote:

Damn, Lazzers, that post was superb.

Indeed. I've seen Harris in the POTC films in which most of the cast were terrible including her but she was rather good in Small Island.

I'll play the waiting game and see how she is used in B23.

No, I've become quite content with the absence of the character in the reboot, and if they are going to bring her back, they should at least cast someone more reminiscent of the younger Lois Maxwell.

I too have learned to live without Moneypenny. And actually, Maxwell so thoroughly owned the role I consider it pointless to have anybody else try to fill it.

I'd be interested in seeing, however, whether there's anybody out there who could make us forget Desmond in the role of Q.

Ed Tom Kowalsky wrote:

I'd be interested in seeing, however, whether there's anybody out there who could make us forget Desmond in the role of Q.

I've got a monkey wrench. Will that do?

All that's required for Moneypenny is to look good and have chemistry with a Bond actor. Harris looks fine, if she has the chemistry with Craig then I approve. I don't care if she was cast because of Babs' PC thing, it doesn't matter as long as something good comes out of it. And this is two minute role FFS, why should it matter?

I doubt Fleming would be rolling in his grave over a role like Moneypenny being played by someone who isn't white. If she were ugly, yeah, he probably would be rolling faster than the Tasmanian devil from Looney Tunes.

I think he's been rolling around for quite some time now.

Mr. Brown wrote:

I think he's been rolling around for quite some time now.

No doubt.

And I've got a sick feeling he will be doing summersaults and full layout twisting Tsukaharas with a three-quarter pike in about 16 months.

I vote no. MP should be forever modeled on Maxwell's MP. She established the role over 23 years. It is what it is.
MP is white, English and modestly attractive but not in a vavoom Bond girl way.
Pamela Salem, Caroline Bliss and Samantha Bond all fit the general description, even if Bond's MP was a little cheekier than what we were used to.

Ed Tom Kowalsky wrote:

Mr. Brown wrote:

I think he's been rolling around for quite some time now.

No doubt.

And I've got a sick feeling he will be doing summersaults and full layout twisting Tsukaharas with a three-quarter pike in about 16 months.

If B23 turns out the way we fear it might, Fleming might just rise from the grave, and zombie like, track down Babs, eat her brains, and dragging Cubby along with him, read the riot act to MGW.
Then pay a visit to Deaver and tell him to give Bond some height, and make him a little less nice.

Then back to the great thriller library in the sky.

I did not care much for Bond's portrayal of the character. I think MP worked best in the early Connery Bonds. She needs to be portrayed by an actress who is in her mid to late 30s to early 40s, and has a more grounded and less glamorous type of attractiveness. She cannot double for a real Bond girl.

The problem with Maxwell in the Moore years was (especially later on) her age. It just got to a point where the banter between the two of them became cringe-worthy.

That's true, Salomoppers. And by OP I'm afraid Maxwell had become downright hard on the eyes. Moneypenny shouldn't be a stunner, but neither should she be a beast.

Makeshift Python wrote:

I don't care if she was cast because of Babs' PC thing, it doesn't matter as long as something good comes out of it.

There's no reason why Harris can't be a decent Moneypenny in the next film, but it's what will "come out of it" long term which worries me. It feels like just one more step towards Bond 25, 26 or 27 having Bond as a handicapped black male with a lisp and a wheelchair being pushed around by superior women in a cast that reads like luvvies-R-us, all of it brought to us by the writer and director of The King's Speech, with Babs sat there at the Oscars with a big fat smug grin on her face and the kids raving about it on Facebook, whilst Fleming fans and fortysomething males everywhere furiously try to figure out the easiest way to kill themselves. Exaggeration? Of course, but I definitely feel there's a road being travelled here which could end in Babs getting exactly what she wants, even if it means cutting off a huge amount of the hands which have fed her for the last few decades.