Bond 25 (2019)

Blunt Instrument wrote:

Strictly speaking (as the director of the 2012 London Olympics opening ceremony) Boyle has already directed Craig's Bond.    

QE2 as Bond Girl....

I don't see the appeal of Boyle, more-so as a Bond director. Bond entries aren't by themselves David Lean works of art. For some reason, with Boyle, I sense another QOS type entry. All style, some substance and very little inbetween.

You mean less so, surely, Hilly?

Of course, sorry Ambler.

Supposedly Boyle will direct Bond 25 at the end of this year if Hodge's script works out. Considering two scripts are currently being written, I imagine Craig will have a say in which one he'd want to make.

That said, I'd say Purvis and Wade's screenplay will probably be stronger. There has been more time for it to develop. Hodge just came on board to flesh out/develop Boyle's idea. If they hope for production to begin at the end of 2018 (November/December), pre production would need to start very soon, and that doesn't include rewrites.

After six movies and almost two decades of Purvis & Wade, isn't it about time for another voice to get a crack at writing Bond?

Isn't young Q busy with a Shakespeare play in London? Does anyone know more about this? Looks like a very optimistic fairy-tale timetable to me...

Could always re-employ R.

Boyle is finally Vaughn directing the series. Do you know Michael G. Wilson turned down Vaughn because he proposed an action scene shot in the dark? It thought it was silly. We got it in Kick Ass instead. Vaughn & Boyle are the ones who suggested Craig. It fits.

Salomé wrote:

After six movies and almost two decades of Purvis & Wade, isn't it about time for another voice to get a crack at writing Bond?

Well, considering Tamahori heavily rewrote DAD, CR smells of Haggis, QOS wasn't written by them and they only came into polish SPECTRE to make it feel more Bondian (they can't be attributed the serious structural flaws of the film), the only two Bond films I rate highly since 1999 are TWINE and SF. I'm happy for them to stay. 

Hilly wrote:

Could always re-employ R.

I like that thought.

Not gonna be too upset if NuAge Q fucks off forever.

I didn't mind how he was used in SF, but stickers on his laptop in SP? Please...

In other news, Bond #25 will be supposedly influenced by the Times Up movement, if Boyle has his way. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5511999/James-Bond-respect-Times-movement-latest-film.html 

Ordinarily, Bond news excites me. I couldn't care less anymore.

Time's up for the franchise.

Is "Bond changing his attitudes" going to be the new "My Bond girl is different"? I feel like future Bonds will bend over backwards trying to show how "progressive" their new Bond is compared to that old dinosaur the previous one was and not to mention it will just ended up dating the film even further than the old attitudes of the fun Bond movies ever did. When RoboBond3000 takes over the role and battles Blofeldbot420 in the year 2072 (which will be exactly when we see Bond 26 at this given rate) maybe we'll finally move back to Bond just being Bond again.

We all draw different lines in the sand.

For Fields, it was not renewing Brozza's contract; for Gravity, it would be a black Bond; for Dog, it's unexciting car chases and stunts. I suppose indulging the dangerous delusions of highly privileged women should be mine.

Except James Bond embracing the #thatmansplainingprickopenedadoorforme movement is nothing new. His propaganda spot for International Women's Day was filmed way back in 2011, yet it was followed the next year by Skyfall, one of the best Bond films ever made.

Let's see how this plays out.

I very much doubt that Times Up will influence Bond, except perhaps in the most minor of varnishes applied to the screenplay. Bond cannot exist within a universe where Times Up is followed to its extremes.

Strangways&Quarrel wrote:

Is "Bond changing his attitudes" going to be the new "My Bond girl is different"? I feel like future Bonds will bend over backwards trying to show how "progressive" their new Bond is compared to that old dinosaur the previous one was and not to mention it will just ended up dating the film even further than the old attitudes of the fun Bond movies ever did. When RoboBond3000 takes over the role and battles Blofeldbot420 in the year 2072 (which will be exactly when we see Bond 26 at this given rate) maybe we'll finally move back to Bond just being Bond again.

It would be nice if they managed to merely give us a somewhat memorable Bond girl. How long has it been since they managed even that?

Erica Ambler wrote:

We all draw different lines in the sand.

For Fields, it was not renewing Brozza's contract; for Gravity, it would be a black Bond; for Dog, it's unexciting car chases and stunts. I suppose indulging the dangerous delusions of highly privileged women should be mine.

Except James Bond embracing the #thatmansplainingprickopenedadoorforme movement is nothing new. His propaganda spot for International Women's Day was filmed way back in 2011, yet it was followed the next year by Skyfall, one of the best Bond films ever made.

Let's see how this plays out.

Exactly. I seem to remember there was a rumour that due to the perceived threat posed by HIV/AIDS, Dalton's Bond would be issued with condoms by Q Branch and there'd be a scaling-down of his sexist/womanising ways.

The first thing turned out to be untrue, and as for the second ... I count 4 shags across 2 movies (girl on boat, Kara, Pam, Lupe). And the patting of Moneypenny's arse in TLD and the 'It's a man's world' patronising of Pam in LTK.

Salomé wrote:

It would be nice if they managed to merely give us a somewhat memorable Bond girl. How long has it been since they managed even that?

Fiona 53 years ago.

Last memorable Bond girl? 1989. (Elektra to me is a sort of category to herself.)
Last memorable film? 1989.
Last time Bond mattered as a flesh and blood character? 1989.

Hmm..there's a pattern isn't there...and I adore Goldeneye/TND/TWINE/DAD faults and all...but the 90's era was the beginning of the shift towards modern trends wreaking havoc in the universe of 007 and catering to current of the moment profiling etc. But at least they didn't throw away the character wholeheartedly and let just anyone show up to piss on it some more.

While I feel Boyle is the safest choice amongst the current available people around, it certainly won't result in anything interesting, anything exciting or anything in tone with the original series. It should be an improvement over Sam Mendes directing an action adventure film, but most anything would. At least they didn't go to Vaughn or -pukes- Tarantino. (Why in all that is holy does he of all people get to do Star Trek now? Seriously!)

However if they had balls, and the gall they tried to say they had when dumping PB and signing the then "wild card" idea of Craig (hey, remember Craignotbond.com...those were the days weren't they?) what they should do is finally, finally, finally ante up and bring Ridley Scott on board.
Mic dropped.

Want the incredible visuals? The grand photography of both massive lairs and common interiors? Actual understanding of tone? Character?
Scott could do it all. Not that I'm saying it would be perfect or anything, but he would do it correctly without falling into many of the pitfalls people do these days with big studio franchise pieces. Plus he'd likely shoot it fast which is key for getting the right level of 007 drive in a narrative. He has done serious spy/espionage thrillers that while not great are at least relevant and have interesting moments, he can do the action, he can do modern and classic techniques. The series needs a big kick in the rear to get going again-even to be more visible in the public consciousness.

To be blunt: Mission Impossible is completely usurping Bond yet again, as though the new trailer isn't 100% enticing it has more effect on desire than any of this 25 news.

hegottheboot wrote:

To be blunt: Mission Impossible is completely usurping Bond yet again.

Tommy makes Danny look like a barefoot little boy. Babs will be making notes, and I won't be surprised if they are trying to figure out what made Black Panther such a phenomenal hit and incorporating some of that into Bond.

Erica Ambler wrote:

Except James Bond embracing the #thatmansplainingprickopenedadoorforme movement is nothing new. His propaganda spot for International Women's Day was filmed way back in 2011, yet it was followed the next year by Skyfall, one of the best Bond films ever made.

That's true, but I think Skyfall's success has something to do with Purvis and Wade's involvement from the get go and the fact that it was the 50th anniversary film, which dictated a celebration of the past (and thematically - probably Logan and Mendes' contribution - that worked too). 

As cringe-inducing as it was, Craig in the dress is still somewhat separate the films. The films have a far greater reach than a TV spot that no one remembers besides us. 

BI wrote:

I seem to remember there was a rumour that due to the perceived threat posed by HIV/AIDS, Dalton's Bond would be issued with condoms by Q Branch and there'd be a scaling-down of his sexist/womanising ways. 

The first thing turned out to be untrue, and as for the second ... I count 4 shags across 2 movies (girl on boat, Kara, Pam, Lupe). And the patting of Moneypenny's arse in TLD and the 'It's a man's world' patronising of Pam in LTK.

The idea that Dalton was the "sexless" Bond always fascinated me. His second film shows two birds fighting over him at the end. In the other films where both main Bond girls survive (Honey and Sylvia, Tanya and Sylvia, Octopussy and Magda), it's never been a point of conflict. 

Salome wrote:

It would be nice if they managed to merely give us a somewhat memorable Bond girl. How long has it been since they managed even that?

I'd say Elektra, though in a less traditional sense (due to lack of screen time), Severine is still talked about, for being so tragic.

Onatopp, Wai Lin and Elektra seem to be the most popular from the more recent films. 

HGTB wrote:

Last memorable Bond girl? 1989. (Elektra to me is a sort of category to herself.)
Last memorable film? 1989.
Last time Bond mattered as a flesh and blood character? 1989.

Hmm..there's a pattern isn't there...and I adore Goldeneye/TND/TWINE/DAD faults and all...but the 90's era was the beginning of the shift towards modern trends wreaking havoc in the universe of 007 and catering to current of the moment profiling etc. But at least they didn't throw away the character wholeheartedly and let just anyone show up to piss on it some more.

I have to disagree and say that Pam and Lupe don't qualify for being the last memorable girls - they aren't memorable at all really. They just don't compare to girls of the 60s. 

And Goldeneye is a much more iconic, memorable and layered film than LTK, which is far too one-note and lacking in charisma comparatively.

FieldsMan wrote:

The idea that Dalton was the "sexless" Bond always fascinated me. His second film shows two birds fighting over him at the end. In the other films where both main Bond girls survive (Honey and Sylvia, Tanya and Sylvia, Octopussy and Magda), it's never been a point of conflict.

But isn't this a comment upon the ladies' sexuality instead of Bond's?

FieldsMan wrote:

BI wrote:

I seem to remember there was a rumour that due to the perceived threat posed by HIV/AIDS, Dalton's Bond would be issued with condoms by Q Branch and there'd be a scaling-down of his sexist/womanising ways. 

The first thing turned out to be untrue, and as for the second ... I count 4 shags across 2 movies (girl on boat, Kara, Pam, Lupe). And the patting of Moneypenny's arse in TLD and the 'It's a man's world' patronising of Pam in LTK.

The idea that Dalton was the "sexless" Bond always fascinated me. His second film shows two birds fighting over him at the end. In the other films where both main Bond girls survive (Honey and Sylvia, Tanya and Sylvia, Octopussy and Magda), it's never been a point of conflict. 

Salome wrote:

It would be nice if they managed to merely give us a somewhat memorable Bond girl. How long has it been since they managed even that?

I'd say Elektra, though in a less traditional sense (due to lack of screen time), Severine is still talked about, for being so tragic.

Onatopp, Wai Lin and Elektra seem to be the most popular from the more recent films. 

HGTB wrote:

Last memorable Bond girl? 1989. (Elektra to me is a sort of category to herself.)
Last memorable film? 1989.
Last time Bond mattered as a flesh and blood character? 1989.

Hmm..there's a pattern isn't there...and I adore Goldeneye/TND/TWINE/DAD faults and all...but the 90's era was the beginning of the shift towards modern trends wreaking havoc in the universe of 007 and catering to current of the moment profiling etc. But at least they didn't throw away the character wholeheartedly and let just anyone show up to piss on it some more.

I have to disagree and say that Pam and Lupe don't qualify for being the last memorable girls - they aren't memorable at all really. They just don't compare to girls of the 60s. 

And Goldeneye is a much more iconic, memorable and layered film than LTK, which is far too one-note and lacking in charisma comparatively.

Ouch! :)

To be fair I can understand you on GE vs. LTK because I'll be the first to admit it took me years to fully appreciate LTK due to the budget cuts/80's derivative styles and lower key flavor. I think it has a stronger narrative base but GE has all the gloss and grandeur.
Also I cherish GE, but think LTK is the last gasp of the old series being firmly rooted in itself as opposed to being reactionary to modern society. Does that make any sense or am I babbling again?

I guess I'm a sucker for actually strong female roles where they can grumble a bit and act human in addition to being imperfect. That and Pam's Isthmus makeover ...and being reintroduced with the shotgun under the bar table...I actually felt Pam was the first girl since the 60's films to really feel in line with the role in the films.
I quite like Natalya (Goldeneye 64 horror memories aside) but she and the following regular Bond girl characters have always seemed to have taken a backseat to everything else and merely been present only when the plot devices require them. That may be just me of course. I really began to like her more after reading her fleshed out characterization in Gardner's novelization.

Many bring up Dalton's tenure as being sexless and humorless. Just as many think the actors themselves make all the decisions and only the lead actor matters. What these people miss and refuse to notice in Dalton's two films is that they are some of the only times where the rampant sex is replaced with actual romance befitting the story itself. That and the fact that the humor is beautifully and realistically played that perfectly fits the ongoing events. The romance aspect was a masterstroke on the production team's part in responding to the AIDS crisis and growing public discourse over the nature of Bond...so of course people didn't give the new Bond a real chance and so...

No intention to offend with my post, HGTB- apologies if it came across that way. :) 

Again, I think a case could be made for the 90s Bond films being the last gasp of the old series. As I've said before, M's comments in GE are simply her opinion of Bond (and Bond has his own for her) and doesn't expect him to change. That's continued into TND, where she realises he could pump Paris for information. By contrast, M's "how many is that now" in QOS and Bond moping around because of it is definitely a change of direction (sex is bad, kids), and definitely the wrong direction. 

Never played GE 64 or read Gardner's novel, so neither influence my opinion of Natalya, who is without a doubt one of the finest Bond girls. 

Can't disagree with your last paragraph. Kara is a fine addition into the pantheon of Bond girls - her romance with Bond is one of the most organic in the series.